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3.5 Deputy T.A. Vallois of St. Saviour of the Minister for Treasury and Resources regarding proposed changes to the Resources Department.
What are the proposed changes, if any, to the Resources Department? Are there any areas which will be returned to the Chief Minister's Department and if so, why?
Senator P.F.C. Ozouf (The Minister for Treasury and Resources):
I thank Deputy Vallois for her pertinent and important question. In June, the Director of Resources, who was also the Deputy Chief Executive, was appointed to the role of Acting Chief Executive of the States for a 12-month period. The Director of Resources and the Deputy Chief Executive roles have not been replaced and therefore one individual is covering both roles. Arrangements are in place to ensure effective reporting line in this interim 12-month period and they are that the Human Resources, Information Services, and the Comprehensive Spending Review team will report to the Acting Chief Executive in the Chief Minister's Department, although effectively that is a Resources function, and Procurement and Property Holdings, while previously reporting to the Director of Resources, will report to the Treasurer of the States.
- Deputy T.A. Vallois:
In June last year, there was a movement of £17 million from the Chief Minister's Department to Treasury to cover the H.R. (Human Resources) and I.T. move. Could the Minister for Treasury and Resources please explain whether that money has been moved back to cover the Resources?
Senator P.F.C. Ozouf :
No, the function and the budget for all of those departments remain in Treasury and Resources. There is the Acting Chief Executive. While he is the Chief Executive of the States of Jersey, he has his other role, which is Director of Resources, and he is continuing to discharge that oversight of the I.T. and H.R. Departments, as the Deputy quite rightly points out. There have been no changes in terms of the structure and there are no changes envisaged.
- Senator S.C. Ferguson:
This is a bit unusual. It rather feels that the Resources Department is being dismembered. How does the proposed reorganisation of Jersey Property Holdings fit in with this?
Senator P.F.C. Ozouf :
I think I am answering questions from the Senator on Property Holdings and happy to deal with them there. It does not fit in at all. The fact is that Jersey Property Holdings is going to report to the Treasurer of the States. We retain the Treasury and Resources distinct departmental separation with the Chief Minister's Department although in both the Chief Minister's and my case, we do not see silos in relation to the 2 departments but there are, of course, important budget holding differences.
- The Deputy of St. Mary :
Is the current position, which is due to one person doing 2 jobs or possibly 3, going to be unscrambled when the new Chief Executive takes up their post and are we then going to have a Director of Resources as before? Will that be then back in the Treasury or is this scrambled situation going to continue? I am not clear where this is going to evolve.
Senator P.F.C. Ozouf :
I think that is a good question and those issues are going to continue to be discussed with the Chief Minister and the Treasury Department over the coming weeks in order to get the right structure. There is concern about senior pay, there is concern about the numbers of senior people in the States, and here we have an example where one individual is discharging 2 functions. We are rationalising the top management of the States in order to save money, not just at different areas of the States but the whole structure of the States and the whole management scene is being looked at and I would have thought the Members would welcome that.
- Deputy R.G. Le Hérissier:
Who has ultimate political responsibility for these functions and to whom does the acting person report?
Senator P.F.C. Ozouf :
The S.E.B. (States Employment Board) is chaired by the Chief Minister and he alone. I have asked my Assistant Minister to be part of S.E.B. from a Treasury point of view but the Chief Minister and the S.E.B. are the employer. The operational sides of the departments are, if I may say, largely non-political in their endeavours because they are management departments. They are ultimately the accountability of the Minister for Treasury and Resources to the extent that there is any operational oversight. Employment to the Chief Minister under S.E.B. The rest of it is within Treasury and Resources.
- Deputy A.E. Jeune :
Did I hear the Minister correctly when he was replying to Deputy Vallois' question in that did he say that where the Acting Chief Officer will retain his role within Resources, other than that, there will be no changes?
Senator P.F.C. Ozouf : Yes.
- Deputy T.A. Vallois:
With the complexities of the system as it currently stands, could the Minister reassure me that there will be no conflicts of interest between States of Jersey Development Company and Jersey Property Holdings?
Senator P.F.C. Ozouf :
That is another matter which is the subject of Senator Ferguson's question and I propose to deal with that then but the short answer is no.