States Meeting Transcript - 20th March 2012

STATES OF JERSEY OFFICIAL REPORT TUESDAY, 20th MARCH 2012

QUESTIONS......................................................................................8

1. Written Questions........................................................................8

1. THE DEPUTY OF GROUVILLE OF THE MINISTER FOR TRANSPORT AND TECHNICAL SERVICES REGARDING ECO-FRIENDLY PARKING PERMITS:....8
2. THE DEPUTY OF GROUVILLE OF THE MINISTER FOR TREASURY AND RESOURCES REGARDING THE TENDER PROCESS FOR LANDSCAPE AND ARCHITECTURAL SERVICES:........................................................9
3. DEPUTY S.S.P.A. POWER OF ST. BRELADE OF THE MINISTER FOR EDUCATION, SPORT AND CULTURE REGARDING REPLACEMENT VEHICLES FOR THE ELIZABETH CASTLE FERRY SERVICE:................................11
4. DEPUTY S.S.P.A. POWER OF ST. BRELADE OF THE MINISTER FOR EDUCATION, SPORT AND CULTURE REGARDING THE PENSION ENTITLEMENTS OF JERSEY HERITAGE TRUST STAFF:.........................12
5. DEPUTY S.S.P.A. POWER OF ST. BRELADE OF THE MINISTER FOR EDUCATION, SPORT AND CULTURE REGARDING JERSEY HERITAGE TRUST'S VEHICLE LEASES:........................................................13
6. THE CONNÉTABLE OF ST. JOHN OF THE CHAIRMAN OF THE PRIVILEGES AND PROCEDURES COMMITTEE REGARDING THE DECLARATION OF MEMBERS' INTERESTS:.............................................................13
7. CONNÉTABLE OF ST. JOHN OF THE MINISTER FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT REGARDING SHIPPING ROUTES:...............................18
8. DEPUTY G.P. SOUTHERN OF ST. HELIER OF THE MINISTER FOR HOUSING REGARDING SOCIAL HOUSING RENTS:..........................................18
9. DEPUTY G.P. SOUTHERN OF ST. HELIER OF THE MINISTER FOR SOCIAL SECURITY REGARDING THE NUMBER OF CLAIMS AND TOTAL SUMS FOR INCOME SUPPORT SPECIAL PAYMENTS:.........................................21
10. DEPUTY G.P. SOUTHERN OF ST. HELIER OF THE CHIEF MINISTER REGARDING PUBLIC SECTOR EMPLOYEES' TERMS AND CONDITIONS OF SERVICE:..............................................................................24
11. DEPUTY G.P. SOUTHERN OF ST. HELIER OF THE MINISTER FOR HEALTH AND SOCIAL SERVICES REGARDING SERVICE LEVEL AGREEMENTS WITH THIRD SECTOR PROVIDERS:.......................................................25
12. DEPUTY G.P. SOUTHERN OF ST. HELIER OF THE MINISTER FOR TREASURY AND RESOURCES REGARDING THE IMPACT OF TAXES ON ISLANDERS' DISPOSABLE INCOMES IN 2012:....................................................26

2. Oral Questions...........................................................................27

1. Deputy S. Power of St. Brelade of the Minister for Treasury and Resources regarding the further development of the Waterfront:.................................................27 Senator P.F.C. Ozouf (The Minister for Treasury and Resources):............................27

1. Deputy S.Power:.......................................................................27
2. Senator S.C. Ferguson:.................................................................27
3. Connétable A.S. Crowcroft of St. Helier:...............................................28
4. Deputy M. Tadier of St. Brelade:.......................................................28

2. Deputy G.P. Southern of St. Helier of the Minister for Health and Social Services regarding current vacancy rates of nursing staff:........................................28 Connétable J.M. Refault of St. Peter (Assistant Minister for Health and Social Services - rapporteur):.............................................................................28

1. Deputy G.P. Southern :..................................................................29
2. Deputy M. Tadier :......................................................................29
3. Deputy R.G. Le Hérissier of St. Saviour:...............................................29
4. Deputy M. Tadier :......................................................................29
5. Deputy G.P. Southern :..................................................................30
6. Deputy G.P. Southern :..................................................................30

3. Deputy R.J. Rondel of St. Helier of the Minister for Transport and Technical Services regarding increased car parking facilities in St. Helier : .................................30 Deputy K.C. Lewis of St. Saviour (The Minister for Transport and Technical Services): .....30

1. Deputy T.M. Pitman of St. Helier:......................................................30

2. Deputy T.M.Pitman:...................................................................31
3. Deputy G.P. Southern :..................................................................31
4. Deputy G.P. Southern :..................................................................31
5. The Connétable of St. Helier:...........................................................31
6. Deputy J.A. Martin of St. Helier:.......................................................32
7. Deputy J.A. Martin:....................................................................32
8. Deputy M. Tadier :......................................................................32
9. Senator L.J. Farnham :..................................................................32
10. Deputy J.H. Young of St. Brelade : ..................................................33
11. The Connétable of St. Peter:.........................................................33

4. Deputy J.H. Young of the Minister for Planning and Environment regarding high density urbanized redevelopment of properties within small built-up areas identified in the Island Plan 2002: ..............................................................................33 Deputy R.C. Duhamel of St. Saviour (The Minister for Planning and Environment):.........34

1. Deputy J.H. Young:....................................................................34
2. Deputy M. Tadier :......................................................................34
3. Connétable S.W. Pallett of St. Brelade:.................................................35
4. Deputy J.H. Young:....................................................................35
   5. Deputy T.M. Pitman of the Minister for Home Affairs regarding the resources of the States of Jersey Police to deal with cyber-crime':......................................35 Senator B.I. Le Marquand (The Minister for Home Affairs): .................................35

1. Deputy T.M.Pitman:...................................................................35
2. Deputy J.A. Martin:....................................................................36
3. Deputy T.M.Pitman:...................................................................36
4. Deputy T.M.Pitman:...................................................................36

6. Connétable M. Le Troquer of St. Martin of the Minister for Home Affairs regarding...37 Senator B.I. Le Marquand (The Minister for Home Affairs): .................................37
7. Deputy M. Tadier of H.M. Attorney General regarding the reconsideration of decisions made by a Minister's predecessor:......................................................37

Mr. T.J. Le Cocq Q.C., H.M. Attorney General: ..............................................37

1. Deputy M. Tadier :......................................................................38
2. Deputy T.M.Pitman:...................................................................38
3. Deputy T.M.Pitman:...................................................................38
4. Deputy M.R. Higgins of St. Helier:.....................................................38
5. Deputy J.H.Young:....................................................................39
6. Deputy M. Tadier :......................................................................39

8. Deputy R.G. Le Hérissier of St. Saviour of the Chief Minister regarding the compatibility of work and/or residence permits with Protocol 3:........................39 Senator P.F. Routier (Assistant Chief Minister - rapporteur):.................................39

1. Deputy R.G. Le Hérissier: ..............................................................40
2. Deputy J.A. Martin:....................................................................40
3. Deputy G.P. Southern :..................................................................40
4. Senator S.C. Ferguson:.................................................................40
5. Deputy C.F. Labey of Grouville :........................................................41
6. Deputy M.R.Higgins:..................................................................41
7. Deputy T.A. Vallois of St. Saviour:....................................................41
8. Deputy J.A. Hilton of St. Helier:........................................................42
9. Deputy J.A. Martin:....................................................................42
10. Deputy S.Power:....................................................................42
11. Deputy R.G. Le Hérissier:...........................................................42

9. Deputy M. Tadier of the Chief Minister regarding a review of legal fees and the legal aid system:.................................................................................43 Senator I.J. Gorst (The Chief Minister):......................................................43

1. Deputy M. Tadier :......................................................................43
2. Deputy M.R.Higgins:..................................................................44
3. Deputy T.M.Pitman:...................................................................44
4. Deputy T.A. Vallois: ...................................................................44
5. Deputy J.H. Young:....................................................................44
6. Senator S.C. Ferguson:.................................................................45
7. Deputy M. Tadier :......................................................................45

10. Deputy T.M. Pitman of the Chairman of the Privileges and Procedures Committee regarding the democratic deficit in relation to representation in the Assembly between heavily populated and less populated Parishes: .........................................45 The Connétable of St. Helier (The Chairman of the Privileges and Procedures Committee):..45

1. Deputy T.M.Pitman:................................................................46
2. Deputy T.M.Pitman:................................................................46

11. Deputy G.P. Southern of the Minister for Treasury and Resources regarding the use of Personal Service Companies and Employee Benefit Trusts to avoid tax:................46 Senator P.F.C. Ozouf (The Minister for Treasury and Resources):............................46

1. Deputy G.P. Southern : ..............................................................47
2. Deputy G.P. Southern : ..............................................................47
3. Deputy G.P. Southern : ..............................................................47
4. Deputy M.R.Higgins:...............................................................48
5. Deputy M. Tadier :...................................................................48
6. Senator S.C. Ferguson:..............................................................48

12. Deputy S. Power of the Minister for Housing regarding the conditions of States accommodation: ........................................................................48 Deputy A.K.F. Green (The Minister for Housing):............................................48

1. Deputy G.P. Southern : ..............................................................49

2. Deputy G.P. Southern : ..............................................................49
3. Connétable M. Le Troquer of St. Martin : ............................................49
4. Deputy J.G. Reed of St. Ouen : ......................................................50
5. Deputy T.A. Vallois:................................................................50
6. Senator P.F.C. Ozouf : ...............................................................51
7. Deputy M. Tadier :...................................................................51
8. Deputy M. Tadier :...................................................................51
9. Deputy G.P. Southern : ..............................................................51
10. Deputy S.Power:.................................................................51

13. Deputy R.J. Rondel of the Minister for Transport and Technical Services regarding changes to the existing bus routes when the new bus contract is signed:................52 Deputy K.C. Lewis (The Minister for Transport and Technical Services):....................52

1. Deputy R.J. Rondel:.................................................................52
2. Deputy R.G. Le Hérissier:...........................................................52
3. The Deputy of Grouville : ............................................................52
4. Deputy M. Tadier :...................................................................53
5. Connétable P.J. Rondel of St. John:..................................................53
6. Deputy G.C.L. Baudains of St. Helier : ..............................................53
7. The Connétable of St. John : .........................................................53
8. Deputy G.C.L. Baudains: ............................................................53
9. Deputy R.J. Rondel:.................................................................54

14. The Connétable of St. Martin of the Minister for Housing regarding the Housing maintenance programme:...............................................................54 Deputy A.K.F. Green (The Minister for Housing):............................................54

1. Deputy G.P. Southern : ..............................................................54
2. The Connétable of St. John : .........................................................55

3. Questions to Ministers without notice - The Minister for Transport and Technical Services..................................................................................55

1. Deputy M. Tadier :......................................................................55 Deputy K.C. Lewis (The Minister for Transport and Technical Services):....................55
2. Deputy J.A. Martin:....................................................................55
3. The Connétable of St. John:............................................................55
4. Deputy S.Power:.......................................................................56

3.4.1 Deputy S. Power:.......................................................................56

5. Deputy J.H. Young:....................................................................56
6. Deputy G.C.L. Baudains:...............................................................56
7. Senator L.J. Farnham :..................................................................56

3.7.1 Senator L.J. Farnham :..................................................................57

8. Connétable S.W. Rennard of St. Saviour : ..............................................57

3.8.1 The Connétable of St. Saviour:.........................................................57

9. The Deputy of Grouville :...............................................................57

3.9.1 The Deputy of Grouville :...............................................................58

10. Connétable J. Gallichan of St. Mary : ...................................................58
11. The Connétable of St. Martin:..........................................................58
12. Senator L.J. Farnham :..................................................................58
13. The Connétable of St. John:............................................................58

3.13.1 The Connétable of St. John : .........................................................59

14. The Connétable of St. Mary:............................................................59
15. Senator L.J. Farnham :..................................................................59

16. Deputy J.A. Martin:....................................................................60

3.16.1 Deputy J.A. Martin: .................................................................60

4. Questions to Ministers without notice - The Minister for Economic Development....60

1. Deputy G.P. Southern :..................................................................60 Senator A.J.H. Maclean (The Minister for Economic Development):.........................60
2. Deputy S.Power:.......................................................................60
3. The Connétable of St. John:............................................................61

4.3.1 The Connétable of St. John:............................................................61

4. Deputy R.G. Le Hérissier: ..............................................................61
5. Deputy J.H. Young:....................................................................61
6. Senator L.J. Farnham :..................................................................62
7. Deputy M. Tadier :......................................................................62
8. Deputy M. Tadier :......................................................................62
9. Deputy J.A. Martin:....................................................................63
10. Deputy M.R.Higgins:..................................................................63
11. Deputy J.M. Maçon of St. Saviour:.....................................................63
12. Senator L.J. Farnham :..................................................................64

13. Deputy G.P. Southern :..................................................................64

4.13.1 Deputy G.P. Southern : ..............................................................64

14. Deputy M.R.Higgins:..................................................................64

STATEMENTS ON A MATTER OF OFFICIAL RESPONSIBILITY........................65

5. Statement by the Minister for Economic Development regarding V.A.T. on Commercial Consignments from the Channel Islands:................................65

5.1 Senator A.J.H. Maclean (The Minister for Economic Development):...................65

1. Deputy S.Power:.......................................................................66
2. Deputy R.G. Le Hérissier: ..............................................................66
3. Senator L.J. Farnham :..................................................................66
4. Deputy M.R.Higgins:..................................................................67
5. Connétable D.W. Mezbourian of St. Lawrence:........................................67
6. Deputy G.C.L. Baudains:...............................................................67
7. Deputy J.A. Martin:....................................................................67
8. Senator L.J. Farnham :..................................................................68
9. Deputy M. Tadier :......................................................................68
10. Deputy J.H. Young: .................................................................68

PUBLIC BUSINESS.............................................................................69

6. Old Age Pension: method for increase (P.164/2011)....................................69

1. Senator A. Breckon: ....................................................................69
2. Senator F. du H. Le Gresley (Minister for Social Security): ............................73
3. Deputy R.J. Rondel:....................................................................76

LUNCHEON ADJOURNMENT PROPOSED..................................................77 LUNCHEON ADJOURNMENT................................................................77

4. Senator P.F.C. Ozouf :..................................................................77
5. Deputy M. Tadier :......................................................................78
6. Senator F. du H. Le Gresley:............................................................80
7. Deputy J.A. Martin:....................................................................80

8. Deputy S.G. Lucas of St. Martin:.......................................................82
9. Deputy J.H. Young:....................................................................82
10. The Connétable of St. Brelade:.........................................................84
11. Deputy T.M.Pitman:...................................................................85
12. Deputy A.K.F. Green:..................................................................85
13. Senator P.F. Routier: ...................................................................86
14. Deputy G.P. Southern :..................................................................87
15. Senator I.J. Gorst :......................................................................88
16. Connétable J.L.S. Gallichan of Trinity :.................................................89
17. Deputy P.J.D. Ryan of St. John:........................................................90
18. Deputy S.Power:.......................................................................90
19. The Connétable of Grouville ............................................................91
20. Senator B.I. Le Marquand:..............................................................91
21. Senator A. Breckon: ....................................................................92

7. Draft Civil Partnerships (Consequential Amendments) (Jersey) Regulations 201-, (P.2/2009)................................................................................95

1. Senator I.J. Gorst (The Chief Minister):................................................95
2. Deputy J.H. Young:....................................................................95
3. Deputy J.M. Maçon:....................................................................95
4. Deputy M. Tadier :......................................................................95
5. Deputy T.M.Pitman:...................................................................96
6. Senator I.J. Gorst :......................................................................96
7. Senator P.F.C. Ozouf :..................................................................96
8. Deputy M. Tadier :......................................................................97
9. Deputy G.P. Southern :..................................................................97
10. Senator L.J. Farnham :..................................................................97
11. The Connétable of St. John:............................................................97
12. Senator B.I. Le Marquand:..............................................................97
13. Senator I.J. Gorst :......................................................................98

8. The Draft Civil Partnership (Jersey) Law 2012 (Appointed Day) Act 201- (P.18/2012) ..........................................................................................101

1. Senator I.J. Gorst (The Chief Minister):...............................................102
2. Senator P.F.C. Ozouf :.................................................................102
3. Deputy T.M.Pitman:..................................................................102
4. Deputy M. Tadier :....................................................................102
5. Senator I.J. Gorst :.....................................................................103

9. Planning Applications Panel: appointment of member (P.16/2012) ..................104

1. Deputy R.C. Duhamel (The Minister for Planning and Environment): ................105
2. Deputy M. Tadier :....................................................................105
3. Deputy S.Power:......................................................................105
4. Deputy J.H. Young:...................................................................106
5. Deputy G.P. Southern :................................................................106
6. Senator I.J. Gorst :.....................................................................106
7. The Connétable of St. Helier:..........................................................106
8. Connétable J.L.S. Gallichan of Trinity :................................................107
9. Deputy T.M.Pitman:..................................................................107
10. Deputy R.C. Duhamel: ................................................................107

10. Draft Employment (Jersey) Law 2003 (Amendment Nos. 5, 6 and 7) (Appointed Day) Act 201-. (P.19/2012)...................................................................108

1. Senator F. du H. Le Gresley (The Minister for Social Security): ......................108
2. Deputy G.C.L. Baudains:..............................................................109
3. Deputy G.P. Southern :................................................................109
4. Deputy M.R.Higgins:.................................................................109
5. Deputy J.H. Young:...................................................................109
6. Senator I.C. Breckon: .................................................................110
7. Senator F. du H. Le Gresley:..........................................................110

ARRANGEMENT OF PUBLIC BUSINESS FOR FUTURE MEETINGS ..................112

11. The Deputy Bailiff :....................................................................112

1. The Connétable of St. Helier (Chairman):.............................................112
2. Deputy G.P. Southern :................................................................112
3. Deputy G.P. Southern :................................................................113

ADJOURNMENT..............................................................................113

[09:31]

The Roll was called and the Dean led the Assembly in Prayer.

QUESTIONS

1.Written Questions

1. THE DEPUTY OF GROUVILLE OF THE MINISTER FOR TRANSPORT AND TECHNICAL SERVICES REGARDING ECO-FRIENDLY PARKING PERMITS: Question

Further to the answer to a written question tabled on 21st February 2012 relating to the "eco- friendly parking permits" which were first issued in 2008, would the Minister provide the following further details to enable members to establish a clearer understanding of the success or otherwise of this incentive scheme which is aimed at improving air quality -

1. The total number of vehicles registered for "eco-friendly parking permits" in each of2009 and 2010.
2. The total value (to the nearest pound) ofthe parking scratch cards issued to "eco-friendly" qualifying vehicles in each of 2008, 2009 and 2010.
3. Thetotal number of all vehicles qualifying under emission band B (100/120gm CO2/km) in each of 2008, 2009, 2010 and 2011.
4. The total value (to the nearest pound) ofthe parking scratch cards issued to all qualifying vehicles in band B in each of 2008, 2009, 2010 and 2011.
5. The total number of hybrid vehicles qualifying under emission band B in each of2008, 2009, 2010 and 2011.
6. Thetotal value (tothenearestpound)of the parking scratch cards issuedtohybrid vehicles qualifying under band B in each of 2008, 2009, 2010 and 2011?

Answer

1. The total number of eco permits issued in 2009 was 26, and in 2010 was 47.
2. The total value of 50% discounted scratch cards issued for use by vehicles issued with an eco permit was £1190.70 in 2008, £2,231.30 in 2009, and £4,004.04 in 2010. 50% discounted season tickets for useby vehicles issuedwere also sold amounting to£115.12in 2008, £506.00 in 2009, and £2,827.58 in 2010.
3. CO2 emission figures for vehicles were not gathered until Vehicle Emission Duty was introduced in September 2010. Therefore total vehicles registered on the island which qualified for the scheme in 2008, 2009 and 2010 cannot be determined accurately. Similarly, the vehicle registration database is not configured to extract the information asked for 2011. However, an estimate ofthe number of hybrid vehicles registered that would qualify under emission band B is:-

2009 – 16 2010 - 20

2011 - 32

4. When scratch cards are sold to the general public,they are not asked which vehicle each scratch card is to be used with. TTS do not know which scratch cards sold are used with hybrid vehicles; this information is therefore not available. The scheme is policed by ensuring that vehicles using 50% discount scratch cards are also displaying an eco permit.
5. "Hybrid" has only been recorded as a fuel type since the beginning of 2009. The number of hybrid vehicles first registered in 2009, 2010 and 2011 were 28, 32 and 67 respectively. Of the 67 registered in 2011 (the first full year during which CO2 emissions wererecorded)32of these vehicles were recorded with CO2 emissions qualifying within band B (100-120 g/km). It should be notedthatthecurrent year model Toyota Prius hybridnow qualifies for an eco permit in Band A, but when the scheme started qualified in band B.
6. When scratch cards are sold to the general public,they are not asked which vehicle each scratch card is to be used with. TTS do not know which scratch cards sold are used with hybrid vehicles; this information is therefore not available. The scheme is policed by ensuring that vehicles using 50% discount scratch cards are also displaying an eco permit.

Further to the answer to this question and the question answered on Tuesday 21st February on this subject, I would like to make it absolutely clear that all qualifying hybrid vehicles registered before the cut off point will continue to enjoy the benefit of eco friendly parking as long as the present scheme runs, as vehicles are qualified at the point they are first registered in Jersey. There is no intention to retrospectively apply the new emission requirements to previously registered vehicles circulating on the Island.

Manufacturers of vehicles are continually making improvements to the technology and hybrid vehicles are achieving lower emissions levels as demonstrated by the Toyota Prius. This change to the rules will support the goal of the Sustainable Transport Policy, as amended, of encouraging small low emissions vehicles. As technology advances it is envisaged that there will be further changes to the scheme to ensure that it always incentivise the use of the state of the art vehicles which are overall the least environmentally damaging.

2. THE DEPUTY OF GROUVILLE OF THE MINISTER FOR TREASURY AND RESOURCES REGARDING THE TENDER PROCESS FOR LANDSCAPE AND ARCHITECTURAL SERVICES:

Question

Could the Minister define the formal process by which the landscape design and architectural services for States projects are put out to open competitive tender to the local design industries?

Answer

The majority of procurement of landscape design and architectural services for States projects is undertaken by Jersey Property Holdings and the Housing Department. Their procedures are as follows:-

Jersey Property Holdings

The procurement processes for the engagement of professional services, including Architectural Services and Landscape Design, are set out in Financial Direction 5.6 (The Control of Capital Expenditure) for major capital works and Financial Direction 5.1 (Purchase of Goods and Services) for non capital projects.

The department procuring the service will first consider whether in house services can be used. In the case of Architectural Services, Property Holdings retains a small in-house design team. Use of in-house Architectural Services resource will depend on a number of factors including, capacity, experience and skills available, the scale or urgency of the project and the need for any specialist skills.

The in-house team at TTS Parks and Gardens may be used to provide landscape design for soft areas and to assist with hard landscaping as appropriate.

Where it is not possible or desirable to use the in-house team, a procurement process following the requirements of the relevant Financial Direction will be used to appoint the most appropriate external resource. This will consider on-Island practices in the main, but may also be extended to off-Island practices where it is considered appropriate.

Housing Department Revenue work

It is very rare for the Department to commission landscaping design work within the revenue budget. However the Department does carry out grounds maintenance.

The Ground Maintenance Contract is split into 3 packages comprising of various housing estates across the Island. Currently, this is being delivered by three separate contractors under a 3 year Service Level Agreement which began in 2010. One of the three packages is delivered by the Parks and Gardens section of Transport and Technical Services. This package is not tendered.

The remaining two packages will be re-tendered on the States of Jersey e-portal system towards the middle of 2012. The process will involve an open tender where interested Contractors will complete a pre-qualification questionnaire (PQQ). The PQQ, which looks at the organisation, experience, financial standing, health & safety and approach to training and apprenticeships, will be scored to arrive at a shortlist. The Shortlisted contractors will then be asked to submit a cost, based on specific criteria, for maintaining a package of estates. The Contractors that provide value for money will be awarded a service level agreement (for 3 years) to carry out the maintenance work.

The current incumbents are both local and it is now a condition on all tendering that work should go to local contractors unless:-

• It is specialist work not available on island;
• There is limited local competition and local rates do not offer VFM.

Garden maintenance is not expected to fall into either of these categories so would be local. Capital work

The Department aims to keep landscaping as simple as possible and therefore as cost effective as possible. When it requires specialist soft' landscaping input, it always uses the in-house resources i.e. Parks and Gardens. With hard landscaping, this is normally designed between the Architect and the engineer on each project.

3. DEPUTY S.S.P.A. POWER OF ST. BRELADE OF THE MINISTER FOR EDUCATION, SPORT AND CULTURE REGARDING REPLACEMENT VEHICLES FOR THE ELIZABETH CASTLE FERRY SERVICE:

Question

In relation to the 2 replacement vehicles for the Elizabeth Castle ferry service purchased by the Jersey Heritage Trust in the Summer of 2008 at a cost of £500,000 would the Minister provide the following information to show the operating costs of these two machines in the four calendar years 2008 to the end of 2011:

1: operating costs for 2008 to 2011 including staff, fuel and insurance:

2: mechanical repairs and winter overhauls for 2008, 2009, 2010 and 2011;

3: the cost of re-fitting the machines in the winter of 2011 with hydrostatic drive systems? Answer

The Jersey Heritage Trust (JHT) has provided the following information to answer the Deputy 's question.

2008 2009 2010 2011 Operating Costs 46,960.57  3,198.65  3,353.85  5,896.94  * Fuel 5,446.53  3,077.76  4,530.77  6,807.88 Staff 70,456.27  69,135.16  64,202.26  75,260.33 Insurance 4,897.00  7,345.70  5,729.10  5,729.10

127,760.37  82,757.27  77,815.98  93,694.25

Mechanical  repairs  &  winter

overhaul 78,929.58  153,423.79  121,892.62  256,019.83* Castle admissions revenue £280,166 £298,498 £355,437 £404,596

Includes £80,000 cost of introducing  foam into the hulls of  both vehicles to meet regulatory requirements.

The budgeted cost for re-fitting one castle ferry with a hydrostatic drive system in 2012 is £90,000.

The Jersey Heritage Trust has advised that its survey work shows more than 70% of visitors take the ferry at least in one direction to access Elizabeth Castle. The ferries are viewed as a positive experience by visitors and The Trust believes that revenues and visitor satisfaction would drop dramatically without this form of transport. This is the reason for the investment in their purchase and maintenance.

The Jersey Heritage Trust wished to stress that this aspect of their operation is the subject of the same careful scrutiny as its other activities. As part of this process, the Trustees recently conducted a review of Elizabeth Castle transport to consider possible alternatives. They did not find a viable alternative and therefore concluded they should invest in the conversion of the ferries in order to reduce running costs and increase reliability.

4. DEPUTY  S.S.P.A. POWER  OF  ST.  BRELADE  OF THE  MINISTER FOR EDUCATION,  SPORT  AND  CULTURE  REGARDING  THE  PENSION ENTITLEMENTS OF JERSEY HERITAGE TRUST STAFF:

Question

Can the Minister outline how many members of staff at the Jersey Heritage Trust are on final salary pension plan and part of the Public Employees Contributory Retirement Scheme?

Answer 34

5. DEPUTY S.S.P.A. POWER OF ST. BRELADE OF THE MINISTER FOR EDUCATION, SPORT AND CULTURE REGARDING JERSEY HERITAGE TRUST'S VEHICLE LEASES:

Question

Would the Minister inform members how many vehicles the Jersey Heritage Trust utilises out of the pool of leased cars that Transport and Technical Services Department administer on behalf of the States?

Answer

The Minister for Education, Sport and Culture is not responsible for the day-to-day operations or management of the Jersey Heritage Trust, which would be able to answer such questions directly.

Nevertheless, to assist the Deputy , the ESC has raised the issue with the Trust on his behalf.

The Trust formerly leased a car from Transport and Technical Services but stopped doing so as part of recent cost-cutting measures. It now uses a small van, which it owns. The Trust has raised the possibility of leasing vans from TTS but it has been informed that vehicles are not available on this basis. The Trust has not bought any motor vehicles since 2008.

6. THE CONNÉTABLE OF ST. JOHN OF THE CHAIRMAN OF THE PRIVILEGES AND PROCEDURES COMMITTEE REGARDING THE DECLARATION OF MEMBERS' INTERESTS:

Question

Would the Chairman inform members whether the Data Protection Commissioner was consulted on whether it was appropriate for a member to be required to declare the interests of his or her spouse or partner before the Committee lodged the Amendment (No. 18) to the Standing Orders of the States which will require publication of  interests on the internet and,  if so, what advice was received? If the Commissioner was not consulted would the Chairman explain why this was not done?

Were all candidates standing for election in October 2011 notified in writing of the requirements concerning the interests of spouses/partners and, if so, did this include getting written consent from the spouse/partner agreeing to the publication of interests? Were candidates further notified that it was intended to publish interests on the internet as well as making them available for public inspection in Morier House?

If candidates were not notified, will the Committee be taking action to address the issue and will the Committee agree to delay the implementation of the proposals until the next elections to enable appropriate measures to be taken to address any concerns relating to the interests of spouses/partners?

Answer

Internet research shows that Registers of Interests relating to M.P.s in the House of Commons, Members of the Scott ish Parliament, Members of the Welsh Assembly and Members of the States of Guernsey can all be found and examined on the net. (See appendix)

The Data Protection Commissioner was not consulted immediately prior to the lodging of Amendment (No. 18) to the Standing Orders of the States, however she had been engaged with earlier discussions with the Code of Conduct Working Party, particularly when this issue was first discussed in 2005.

The amendment refers only to the interests of the member, their spouse or co-habitee, but not to any other member of the family. The duty to declare the interests of one's spouse has been included in Standing Orders since 1991 since which time the following have been declarable -

" (b) the name and description of any company, whether registered in Jersey or elsewhere, in which the member or the member's spouse, or both persons jointly, owns more than ten per cent of the issued shares;

(c) a description of any land in Jersey, other than their principal place of residence, which is owned by the member or the member's spouse or both persons jointly and from which either of them derives an income;"

On 6th March 2012, the States agreed that the amendment to Standing Orders which enables publication of a member's interest on the States Assembly website will come into force one month later, namely 6th April 2012.

This amendment was approved following two States' debates. However, the questioner will be aware that the Privileges and Procedures Committee initially proposed publication of the register of members' interests as long ago as 2005 (P.162/2005 refers) as there was consultation with members, and the Committee of the day withdrew this element of the Standing Order changes at a member's request. The matter was brought back to the Assembly by an individual member, the Deputy of St. Martin, and on 9th June 2011 was carried by 39 votes to 9, with 2 abstentions, and the Committee therefore secured the necessary law drafting amendment to Standing Orders for the States' approval to implement that decision, which was debated on 6th March 2012. The revised Standing Order was approved by 38 votes to 5 with one abstention.

The then Deputy of St. Martin also asked a question (6323) of the Committee on this matter on 7th June 2011. Given that matters have been lodged on 3 occasions, consultation with members has occurred, and there was both an earlier written question and a debate during the run up to the last election, I believe there was adequate notice of the provision for prospective candidates.

The Committee as previously constituted did not recommend the online publication of the register of members' interests immediately the proposition was adopted in 2011 and considered that the move to online publication should only be made once the new Assembly has been sworn in, allowing those standing for election to take an informed decision in the full knowledge that the details they will be required to provide as elected members will be published on the Internet. It is the responsibility of prospective candidates for any new position to familiarise themselves with the requirements of the post, and this is also true of the office of States' member. There are a number of obligations placed on anyone who stands for election to the States including the need to abide by the election expenses' regulations, the need to abide by a Code of Conduct and it is the duty of all candidates to ascertain what the constraints of elected office are before standing for election.

It is important to remember that Standing Orders require the Greffier of the States to maintain a register of members' interests and that any person may inspect the register at the offices of the States Greffe during normal working hours. While a photocopy cannot be provided, the Assembly has been advised by the Law Officers that any person could copy out the register and post it on the internet. A member of the public had already expressed an interest in doing so. Were a copy posted on the internet by an individual it may be incomplete and may not be maintained, so that any register put on the internet informally could be misleading, certainly with the passage of time. The Committee took the view that a properly maintained and accurate list will be a better solution. The amendment to Standing Orders was approved by a large majority of the Assembly on 6th March 2012 and there is now no scope for PPC to put this matter on hold as requested by the questioner.

APPENDIX

7. CONNÉTABLE OF ST. JOHN OF THE MINISTER FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT REGARDING SHIPPING ROUTES:

Question

n view of the current difficult economic climate what plans, if any, has the Minister made to ensure continuity of service to keep freight and passenger vessel transport operating in the event of one or more shipping companies ceasing trading to cover the disruption that would be caused?

Answer

As part of normal business practice, the Port of Jersey has contingency plans in place should there be a disruption to freight and passenger vessel transport, for example, in circumstances where a company ceased trading.

The Port of Jersey carried out a thorough investigation into the availability of shipping services both in 2008 and 2012 to ensure continuity of business in the event of the failure of a major operator. The freight volumes to and from Jersey are consistent, hence planning contingencies are quite straight forward than in more volatile markets. While the data remains commercially sensitive I can give assurances that should a freight operator cease trading there is sufficient capacity between the existing operators to cover any disruption.

In terms of passenger services, Port of Jersey has identified suitable alternative provision that could operate in Jersey waters as an interim service until a longer term solution could be secured.

8. DEPUTY G.P. SOUTHERN OF ST. HELIER OF THE MINISTER FOR HOUSING REGARDING SOCIAL HOUSING RENTS:

Question

Will the Minister produce for members the figures on which he has based the statement "Social housing rents and States rents in particular have fallen significantly behind the market" given in response to question 6754 on 6th March 2012?

Will the Minister set out how States and Housing Trust rents compare with the Jersey private sector rent index over the period since 2005 and in particular since 2009 when the index has been largely flat?

Will the Minister justify his response "However, it would not be appropriate for a White Paper on Housing reform to discuss the detailed interaction between rent levels, income tax thresholds, minimum wage and Income Support?" Does the Minister consider that a detailed analysis of this interaction is required before any long-term major policy decisions are made in this area and, if so, when, and by whom, does he expect such analysis to be done and, if not, why not?

Answer

In 2010 the Housing Department undertook a stock condition survey, capital valuation and a review of rents. The rent review was carried out by independent local property management agents experienced in the local private rental market. The review involved inspections of 480 homes across the stock and resulted in the assignment of a potential realistic market rental value for each home.

The  States  Statistics  Unit  compiles  data  on  new  tenancies  being  entered  into  from  records maintained by the Population Office. These figures are included in the Jersey Private Rental Index.

The outcome of the review of rents and the Statistics Unit data were reviewed by Professor Steve Wilcox of the University of York; an expert in the field of rents and rental benefit systems. Professor Wilcox concluded that rents in the social sector were significantly behind the market to varying degrees and provided an unintended, hidden and untargeted subsidy to social housing tenants. It is not realistic to list the current and assessed market equivalent rents for all 4,500 social units held by the States, however, it is possible to group the properties into bands demonstrating to what degree rents are below the market. This is shown below:-

In respect of the second part of this question, I disagree that the Private Sector Rental Index has been largely flat since 2009. It hasn't and in 2011 alone the Index shows a 3% increase on 2010. Rents in the social sector increased by 2.5% that year and then only in October and these increases were matched by a corresponding increase in the Housing Component benefit level ensuring that tenants on Income Support were not financially impacted.

As the chart above displays average rents in the private sector as measured by the Jersey Private Sector Rental Index, increased by 4% between 2002 and 2003 and were then essentially stable until 2006 before rising by 18% during 2007 and 2008.

Annual changes in rent levels in the social sector can be compared to the Jersey Private Rental Index as follows:-

As the table demonstrates between 2007 and 2011 the Jersey Private Rental Index increased by 17.8% more than rents in the Social Housing Sector. This widening of the gap between social and private sector rents is perhaps clearer from the following chart which for context also shows RPI.

The final part of this question is in relation to the response I gave to question 6754 on 6th March 2012. As I set out in my original response, I do not consider that analysing the interaction between rent levels, income tax thresholds, minimum wage and Income Support to be something that needs to be carried out for publication of my White Paper. This detailed analysis is for the Minister for Social Security to carryout in order that he can bring forward proposals for the support of tenants in the private rented sector alongside my Report and Proposition on social housing reform.

9. DEPUTY G.P. SOUTHERN OF ST. HELIER OF THE MINISTER FOR SOCIAL SECURITY REGARDING THE NUMBER OF CLAIMSAND TOTAL SUMS FOR INCOME SUPPORT SPECIAL PAYMENTS:

Question

Will the Minister state what numbers of claims and total sums for Income Support special payments were paid to claimants in 2008, 2009, 2010 and 2011 by group, as follows:

1. Essential household equipment
2. Rental deposit
3. Removal expenses
4. Employment related expenses
5. Medical expenses

1. Additional GP visits
2. Dentistry
3. Chiropody
4. Optician's services
5. Medical products (e.g. dressings)

6. Health & Safety

7. Funerals
8. Failed jobseekers

How many claims paid for dentistry would have been reduced or stopped by the new cap of £500 over 2 years, along with the total savings?

Does the Minister agree that early intervention in this area, is a "spend to save" measure that will prevent greater costs in the long term in line with the approach presented in the Health and Social Services green paper "Caring for each other"?

What consultation has the Minister undertaken with dentists or the Minister for Health and Social Services  to  assess  the  impact  on  dental  health  of  income  support  claimants  and  in  potential increased costs in the long term of the denial of essential and preventative dental surgery resulting from the new limits and, if none, when will he do so?

Answer

The table below provides information on Income Support Special Payments, analysed according to the categories set out in the special payment regulations.

Note that the table does not include data for 2008, which was recorded in a different format. The data for 2011 is based on unaudited accounts. Audited figures will be available later this year. Where appropriate, costs have been allocated proportionately to reflect the year in which the expense arose. In some cases, claim numbers refer to multiple claims for the same household, reflecting different administrative procedures during the years in question.

Under the Income Support law, a household is not entitled to receive benefit if any adult jobseeker within the household fails to actively seek work. In this situation, the special payment regulations provide residual support for the household. It is not possible to separate these costs from other household income support benefit costs.

No claims for urgent dental treatment will be reduced or stopped because of the new rules for dental special payments, as the department will offer an interest free loan if the cost of the urgent treatment exceeds the £500 limit for grants.

In 2011 there were 232 claims that exceeded £500. 50 of these were for over 65s or people in receipt of levels 2 or 3 of the Personal Care component of Income Support and so would be unaffected by the £500 limit on grant payments. 182 claims would have been capped at a grant of £500 from the Department, with any balance above this provided in the form of an interest-free loan. As noted in the report accompanying MD-S-2012-0015, based on the figures for dental special payments in 2011, interest free loans would have replaced grants in respect of approximately £87,000 of claims.

Income Support Special Payments were not designed as a scheme to provide preventative healthcare; they were created in law to assist low income families with unexpected one –off costs, and the claimant needs to show that s/he is "in urgent need of the goods or services being provided[1]", to qualify for the payment.

The role of early intervention in dental care is a matter for the Minister for Health and Social Services. However, our two departments already work closely together, and preventative dental care is promoted through our funding of the Jersey Dental Fitness Scheme, which is targeted at children from low-income families who are aged between 11 and 21 and still in full-time education. Below that age, HSSD provide a school dental service.

As noted in my Ministerial statement of 6 December 2011, I am already committed to a review of the Jersey Dental Fitness Scheme over the next twelve months as part of a broader review into the way the existing funding for dental services is targeted.

"The (SR.12/2010 Scrutiny) Review noted that support with dental costs was available to teenagers through the Dental Fitness Scheme and to pensioners through the 65+ Health Scheme. However, neither of these schemes have been reviewed for a number of years. I will undertake to review the provision of assistance with dental costs under both these schemes during 2012. The reviews will also consider the administration of the two schemes."

Local dentists already consult with the Department both informally and through their participation on the board of the Jersey Dental Fitness Scheme. My officers will be consulting extensively with dentists during the review of dental services, as well as officers at the Health and Social Services Department.

It must be emphasised that there has not been, and will not be, any denial of essential, urgent dental surgery to Income Support customers who cannot afford to pay.

1 Income Support (Special Payments) (Jersey) Regulations 2007 Reg 3(1)

10. DEPUTY G.P. SOUTHERN OF ST. HELIER OF THE CHIEF MINISTER REGARDING PUBLIC SECTOR EMPLOYEES' TERMS AND CONDITIONS OF SERVICE:

Question

Notwithstanding the decision of the SEB only to negotiate on the basis that any pay rise for the public sector in 2012 and 2013 can only be met by cost-saving reductions in employees terms and conditions, does the Chief Minister Consider that Jersey has fallen seriously behind the UK on terms and conditions for workers?

Does the Chief Minister accept that statutory maternity pay terms in Jersey are substantially below those in the UK and does he consider that such differences are a serious impediment in recruiting professionals in such areas as nursing, teaching, medicine and social work, and, if so, what plans does he have in order to address this issue?

Further as he attempts to open genuine negotiations on terms and conditions, and in the light of any proposals on the potential for privatizing or outsourcing public services, will the Chief Minister table the introduction of Transfer of Undertakings (Protection of Employment) legislation at the next meeting with public sector representatives?

Answer

1. Terms and conditions of service for public sector workers in Jersey are broadly aligned to those ofthe United Kingdom (UK). Insome areas they are better and in others theyare behind. Taking into account recent comparability studies across a number of pay groups, and information held within the States Human Resources Department, Jersey has not fallen behind the UK on terms and conditions of service for public sector workers. All terms and conditions of service of different pay groups are currently being reviewed.
2. There is currently no statutory maternity pay in Jersey.

The provision for maternity pay in the public sector varies between 18 and 26 weeks for different pay groups.

States employees are recruited because of the overall employment package Jersey has to offer, including the quality of life, education, pensions, the working environment, remuneration and terms and conditions of service.

A review of the maternity leave provision in the public sector will be addressed as part of the Modernisation Project, currently in development.

3. The development of legislation relating to the Transfer of Undertakings (Protection of Employment) knownasT.U.P.E.rests with the Social SecurityMinister. Therearecurrently no plans to introduce such legislation at this time.

The Chief Minister's view has not changed in relation to T.U.P.E. from the one he has previously stated.

11. DEPUTY G.P. SOUTHERN OF ST. HELIER OF THE MINISTER FOR HEALTH AND SOCIAL SERVICES REGARDING SERVICE LEVEL AGREEMENTS WITH THIRD SECTOR PROVIDERS:

Question

What consultation has taken place between her department and third sector providers to agree new service level agreements over the period of the coming Strategic Plan?

In particular, in the delivery of what specific services is a greater role for third sector envisaged?

Has the Minister made any progress in securing 3-year funding streams for third sector service delivery?

What role does charging play in the delivery of services over the next 3 years? Answer

HSSD has service level agreements (SLA) and provides grants and subsidies to a wide range of Third Sector organisations. Each has a lead officer within HSSD. Lead officers are working, and will continue to work, with SLA holders to review those Agreements. Our aim is to ensure that SLAs are transparent and that they secure the best outcomes for Islanders in relation to quality of service and best value.

HSSD is currently working up plans for service redesign as outlined in the Green Paper. Once the operational details have been finalised and funding secured via the States' Medium Term Financial Plan, we will commence commissioning new services and, if necessary review existing service contracts to ensure they continue to deliver real benefit to Islanders. The commissioning process will include a wide range of opportunities for Third Sector providers, the details of which will be made available when finalised.

It is the States' Medium Term Financial planning process that will provide the opportunities to secure three-year funding. HSSD, like other States Departments, is currently working with the Treasury to develop the Plan for presentation to the States during the summer.

HSSD is committed to supporting the Third Sector to be actively involved in the provision of new or different services - we recognise that Third Sector organisations have a unique and valuable role to play as service providers and as agents for change. HSSD will shortly be holding a Third Sector meeting to discuss next steps, plus we are developing an engagement plan which builds on the approach taken in the Green Paper and will involve the co-production of some service development plans with a range of stakeholders, including the Third Sector organisations.

With regard to charging, HSSD is developing user pays proposals for some services as outlined in the 2012 Business Plan.

12. DEPUTY G.P. SOUTHERN OF ST. HELIER OF THE MINISTER FOR TREASURY AND RESOURCES REGARDING THE IMPACT OF TAXES ON ISLANDERS' DISPOSABLE INCOMES IN 2012:

Question

Further to the Fiscal Policy Panel (FPP) report of July 2011 which stated that Jersey workers from all earning bands had suffered a reduction in disposable incomes of around 7 to 9% since 2008, what figure does the Minister have for the impact of his current tax and wage-setting policies on disposable incomes in 2012?

Answer

As there is no official measure of disposable income (income after direct tax) in Jersey the FPP was trying to illustrate the squeeze on incomes as a result of higher commodity prices and, to a lesser extent, changes in direct taxation such as 20 means 20' (which impacted on better off households not all earning bands'). Nowhere in their report do they suggest that there has been a reduction in disposable incomes of 7 to 9% since 2008.

At the time the FPP estimated that earnings growth in June 2011 would be about 1% and that RPI for the same period would average about 2% - suggesting a possible squeeze on income for the year'. However, earnings growth in June 2011 turned out to be 2.5% - broadly in line with inflation over the period - suggesting that part of the squeeze the FPP highlighted did not occur.

The Minister is responsible for bringing forward Budget proposals on taxation to the States for their approval, or amendment. However the level of wages is determined by a number of factors, some of which are outside our control. Pay negotiations for States employees are carried out between the States Employment Board and pay groups. The outcome of these negotiations will be accommodated within the Medium Term Financial Plan and Budgets but may require other compensating measures.

Without a measure of disposable income it is difficult to comment precisely on past trends and even harder to put a figure on trends this year. Nonetheless, the 2012 Budget announced a number of measures that should ease the direct tax burden for some households – income tax exemption thresholds will rise by 4.5% this year and measures have been introduced to support working parents through generous tax relief for childcare costs. The fact that inflation in the early part of the year will remain close to the current rate of 5.0% is of concern but Economics Unit forecasts suggest by the end of year it will have fallen back closer to 3%.

The Minister recognises that this has been a difficult time for households, partly due to factors outside our control like global prices and recession. However, having restored public finances to a sound footing the focus now is on reducing unemployment, job creation for locals and economic growth that will benefit all Islanders.

2. Oral Questions

1. Deputy S. Power of St. Brelade of the Minister for Treasury and Resources regarding the further development of the Waterfront:

Can I briefly thank the Assistant Minister for Education Sport and Culture for the depth of his answer in question 3, the written question; it is much appreciated. Is the Minister concerned that any uncertainty surrounding the development of the Waterfront will prejudice the ability of the States of Jersey Development Company to market the proposed office accommodation as outlined in the Hopkins Masterplan?

Senator P.F.C. Ozouf (The Minister for Treasury and Resources):

As Members will be aware, this is a live legal case and I hope Members will appreciate that I am not in a position to disclose at any time any further information other than that which was set out in the statement that I sent to Members on 5th March. However, I can say with some degree of confidence and certainty that there is, as far as we are concerned, no uncertainty surrounding the development of the Waterfront. Indeed, the States of Jersey Development Company are actively marketing the Jersey International Financial Centre, as the office accommodation will be known, and there are positive discussions with a number of potential interested occupiers.

1. Deputy S. Power:

I appreciate that the Minister cannot disclose any information to do with the litigation, and I would not ask him to, but does the Minister have any concerns that a possible long-drawn-out legal dispute, such as witnessed in the Les Pas Holdings dispute in the Royal Court, may again happen here?

Senator P.F.C. Ozouf :

I can certainly understand why that question would be asked but I have full confidence in the board of S.O.J.D.C. (States of Jersey Development Company), and the previous board, in the way that they have handled matters. There are occasions where there were going to be disgruntled individuals who seek resolution through the courts. As I set out in my statement to Members, I believe that the States of Jersey Development Company is in a very strong position and I want to send a very clear message that any prospect of action, which may or may not take some time, is going to in no way cause any difficulty with the progression of the scheme. This is certainly not, as far as I am concerned, another Les Pas and I certainly do not think that there is anything like the scale of issues, even though there will of course be media reports which will for the time being indicate that there is a problem, but I am confident in the position of the States of Jersey Development Company.

2. Senator S.C. Ferguson:

Does the Minister really believe that, with the volume of office building going on and the lack of demand, it is realistic to carry on with the development of the Esplanade Quarter?

Senator P.F.C. Ozouf :

I think that is a very different question, if I may say so, Sir, but .. The Deputy Bailiff :

It is at the very edges but I have allowed it.

Senator P.F.C. Ozouf :

It is on the edges. That is fine. Yes and indeed I would say to the Senator that it is a matter of some degree of confidence that we are seeing interest in existing players in the Island (and indeed in potential new players) setting up new offices and investing in the Island. There is demand for new office accommodation, particularly new office accommodation which is ergonomic, efficient and suitable for a new modern working environment, of which the Esplanade presents. The private sector is also offering accommodation and there is a competitive market place, which is good for Jersey and good for confidence.

3. Connétable A.S. Crowcroft of St. Helier :

The question concludes: "As outlined in the Hopkins Masterplan." Would the Minister indicate whether the current plans for the site are indeed as outlined in the Hopkins Masterplan or have they changed? Will he give us assurances that the money is supposed to flow from this scheme into urban regeneration and the other environmental benefits are still on the table?

The Deputy Bailiff :

The second part of the question was definitely over the edges. The first part of the question you are free to answer.

Senator P.F.C. Ozouf :

Sir, I was going to say that I could answer the second part of the question because the first part was, I think, within the domain of my colleague, the Minister for Planning and Environment. Generally speaking, yes, I think that is the answer. The Constable has been in positive and active discussions with me and my Assistant Minister about the issues of the use of the potential part of the revenue from the successful completion of part of the site which could be used to kick-start a St. Helier regeneration. I am excited to be able to work with him and the Minister for Transport and Technical Services in order to do that, but we have to secure those tenants to allow that to happen.

[9:45]

4. Deputy M. Tadier of St. Brelade :

The Waterfront area is obviously a prime piece of land. Does the Minister not agree that it should be considered to be put to at least partial cultural use for the arts and not simply for the private sector and the financial industry?

The Deputy Bailiff :

I am sorry the question that is first put is concerning uncertainty regarding the development of the Waterfront as the result of the threats against the Jersey Development Company, as answered by the Minister, and that question is beyond the remit of this question. Final supplementary? Thank you. Then we come to question 2. Deputy Southern will ask a question of the Minister for Health and Social Services.

2. Deputy G.P. Southern of St. Helier of the Minister for Health and Social Services regarding current vacancy rates of nursing staff:

Will the Minister update Members on current vacancy rates by grade of nursing staff, including overall recruitment and retention rates, the numbers engaged on the student nurse programme, the Return to Work initiative and the use of bank or agency nurses, the impact, if any, of staff shortages on specialist service delivery?

Connétable J.M. Refault of St. Peter (Assistant Minister for Health and Social Services -

rapporteur):

If I can crave the indulgence of the Chamber this morning, this is a rather complex question with many areas. I will give a brief oral answer but I do have a draft prepared written answer with all the factual information contained in it. That will be available hopefully by lunchtime today to go out to all the Members. The oral answer is our vacancy rate for registered nursing posts is just under 71 full-time equivalent. Of those available, just under 41 are available to recruit to. The other posts have been offered to potential staff who are awaiting start dates. Forty-one full-time equivalents is equivalent to 5.8 per cent of our registered workforce. This represents approximately a 1 per cent decrease on vacancies when compared to the equivalent month in 2011 and 2010. As I said before, I will provide the remainder of the information in properly fact-checked written information to the Chamber later on, if the Deputy is satisfied with that.

1. Deputy G.P. Southern :

Could the Assistant Minister in particular pay some attention and give us some numbers of the initiative for the local student nurse programme?

The Connétable of St. Peter :

I certainly can. Currently we have approximately 32 student nurses on the local training programme and there is a strong drive to recruit more to that programme whenever available.

2. Deputy M. Tadier :

Does the Minister support the proposed 2-year pay freeze for public sector workers and, if so, does she and her Assistant Minister think that this will have a positive or negative effect on the recruitment and retention of nurses?

The Connétable of St. Peter :

I was looking for a direction there, Sir, it sounds a little wide of the mark to me.

The Deputy Bailiff :

It was very wide of the mark but it was cunningly brought back within the mark at the last second. The Connétable of St. Peter :

Certainly, it has been shown before that there have been a number of studies done on the pay for Jersey nursing staff and it is shown that, compared to the U.K. (United Kingdom), with the cost of living in Jersey there is a shortfall. Any wage restraint that is imposed upon staff generally will have an effect. How much of an effect is impossible to tell.

3. Deputy R.G. Le Hérissier of St. Saviour :

Can the Assistant Minister confirm that locally-trained nurses do, in fact, graduate as fully-fledged and are equivalent to graduate trained nurses that are recruited from elsewhere?

The Connétable of St. Peter :

I cannot give a definitive answer. My instinct is yes they can but I cannot give a definitive answer on that. I do not know the information. I will come back to Deputy with a correct answer later on.

4. Deputy M. Tadier :

The Assistant Minister spoke about a funding gap, essentially, between the conditions in Jersey and the pay and that of the U.K. Can the Assistant Minister talk about what the level of that is? There are different figures in various reports that have been brought out suggesting it might be between 5 and 18 per cent. What does the Assistant Minister think?

The Connétable of St. Peter :

The actual figures are between 7 and 17 per cent. The Deputy is very close on his figures. It depends on whether the housing element is included. If it is, it shows a 17 per cent gap. However, one of the difficulties we have now, particularly with regard to recruitment, which is the most significant element, is that nurses coming into Jersey now tend to be more mature and they come with families. It is usually the problems with the families getting other work as well - husbands particularly - that is causing some of the problems we have. It is not necessarily a purely pay- related problem, pay is just one element of the problem.

5. Deputy G.P. Southern :

Does the Assistant Minister not accept that any rate over 5 per cent is problematic and can he update the House on what progress has been made with the benchmarking exercise with medical professionals?

The Connétable of St. Peter :

I think any ongoing vacancy rate is problematic, irrespective of the level of it; it is something which we do not wish to have and something we cannot control. There are always the unforeseen problems with people, due to illness particularly. We have had 2 registered nurses who have left us in the first part of this year due to health concerns and that is unforeseeable and creates these problems for us. The benchmarking exercise between nurses and fellow professionals was done 2 years ago as part of a study, which produced those figures of between a 7 and 17 per cent differential between the U.K. and

6. Deputy G.P. Southern :

I believe the Assistant Minister could update us. There is an active programme going on benchmarking nursing salaries against fellow professionals.

The Connétable of St. Peter :

I believe there is but I do not have the right information to pass on. I do not wish to mislead him on that. I will come back to him with that information.

The Deputy Bailiff :

Very well, we come to question 3 which Deputy Rondel will ask of the Minister for Transport and Technical Services.

3. Deputy R.J. Rondel of St. Helier of the Minister for Transport and Technical Services regarding increased car parking facilities in St. Helier :

Given his recent acknowledgement in the media that it is increasingly problematic to park a car in St. Helier, would the Minister indicate whether he is committed to providing increased car parking facilities in town and, if so, where and when?

Deputy K.C. Lewis of St. Saviour (The Minister for Transport and Technical Services):

I can confirm that in accordance with established States policy I am committed to providing increased car parking for shoppers. However, with regard to commuter parking, measures to support the S.T.P. (Sustainable Transport Policy) will result in a reducing demand for commuter parking. The masterplan was approved in June last year. I proposed in addition to the Ann Court housing development, private developments at Le Masurier, Bath Street; Jersey Brewery site, Ann Street; and the Jersey Gas site, Tunnel Street, would also be required to provide publically- accessible parking.

1. Deputy T.M. Pitman of St. Helier :

Is the Minister aware, as I am sure he is, that there are regularly 200 spaces free up at Pier Road? Knowing that, would he perhaps consider to help matters for the public, instead of moving all the States parking from the other parking which is Sand Street and Snow Hill, and have everyone parked up Pier Road?

Deputy K.C. Lewis :

The Deputy is quite correct, there is spare capacity at Pier Road. I think currently around 250 spaces are free daily. Sadly, it is not a popular car park but we are looking at several schemes to entice people up there. We are rolling out the A.N.P.R. (Automatic Number Plate Recognition)

system in Sand Street Car Park which will make parking less problematic. That is something, all being well, we will continue on to Pier Road Car Park. We are looking at several initiatives to encourage people up there.

2. Deputy T.M. Pitman:

Would the Minister agree that perhaps one of the incentives could be some sort of fitness regime? Not all States Members are as beautifully trim as myself, so we could all be encouraged to walk up there.

Deputy K.C. Lewis :

I agree with the Deputy . I too park occasionally up at Pier Road but it is that hill that does put people off. We are looking at several ways of encouraging people up there.

The Deputy Bailiff :

That is more a question for the Minister for Health and Social Services, I think. Deputy Southern ?

3. Deputy G.P. Southern :

What conversations has the Minister had with the Constable of St. Helier over the possible releasing of Parish-owned sites for parking as suitable venues within town?

Deputy K.C. Lewis :

I have had several discussions with the Constable of St. Helier and I am more than happy to have more to see where we can work together to ease the problem.

4. Deputy G.P. Southern :

Besides conversations, can we  have some action on releasing Parish-owned sites  for possible parking?

The Deputy Bailiff :

That is not a question for the Minister. It would be a question for the Parish. The Connétable of St. Helier ?

5. The Connétable of St. Helier :

Perhaps the Minister could start by confirming that most Parish-owned car parks are indeed used for public parking. I would like to ask the Minister if he remembers that 2 years ago I drew to the attention of the Assembly when we debated the Transport Policy that hundreds of spaces in the ownership of States departments, particularly Harbours but also Housing and E.S.C. (Education, Sport and Culture) are used as cash cows by those departments and are leased out for private hire. I was given assurances in that debate that the department would be looking at ways of bringing back those privately-leased spaces into public use, particularly on the Albert Pier where there are spaces very close to Liberty Wharf that could be made use of for shoppers. Has any progress been made on that front and, if not, will the Minister undertake to prioritise this because it could be a quick win for everybody?

Deputy K.C. Lewis :

I am more than happy to look at that again and discuss that with fellow Ministers. We have lost a substantial amount of parking of late with residents parking in town: the Town Park. So, I am more than happy to look wherever I can for additional parking.

6. Deputy J.A. Martin of St. Helier :

It is good to come in after that answer. As I and the other 2 St. Helier No. 1 District Deputies were assured regarding the study of the new police station and the impact of how many parking spaces would be lost (and that if there was too much impact this would not go ahead), would the Minister for Transport and Technical Services inform the House of the impact? In answering the question, can he remember he is the Minister for Transport and Technical Services and not the roll-over Minister for Home Affairs?

Deputy K.C. Lewis :

The 91 spaces at Green Street plus any demand for the new police headquarters, which would be a maximum of 75, can be accommodated at Pier Road which has spare capacity of 250 long-stay parking spaces. I know this is undesirable for many people and, as said previously, we are looking closely at any options we can for further parking in town.

7. Deputy J.A. Martin:

Will the Minister not agree that before the police station was mooted to go there, the next development was Green Street Car Park and it would be on the site where the police station is, over another 250 spaces. The money was there. The plans were there. Why have we done the U-turn? Is he the Minister for Transport and Technical Services? Is he fighting his corner?

Deputy K.C. Lewis :

I am not quite sure where the Deputy is coming from with that one but I am not the sponsoring Minister for the police station; I am reacting to the situation as it is. We are looking for extra spaces wherever we can in the area to use for parking.

8. Deputy M. Tadier :

Will the Minister acknowledge the desirability or otherwise of motorcycles: that they are more efficient both in terms of emissions but, more germanely to this question, in terms of space usage on the street. If so, will the Minister give consideration in conjunction with the Constable of St. Helier to provide more on-street parking for motorcycles?

Deputy K.C. Lewis :

The Deputy makes an excellent point and it is something that T.T.S. (Transport and Technical Services) are actively pursuing: turning more spaces to motorcycle and 2-wheel parking.

9. Senator L.J. Farnham :

As the Minister knows, the creation of the Town Park has critically reduced the amount of parking in the north of town. The situation has been compounded by the fact that an extraordinarily large footpath has been built alongside the town park. The result is a further loss of parking causing a severe problem for businesses in the area. Would the Minister consider as a short-term measure allowing parking on the part of the footpath that will not be used by pedestrians?

Deputy K.C. Lewis :

The footpath I believe the Senator is referring to is Gas Place. I think that would come under the remit of the Constable of St. Helier , but I would not advocate parking on pavements; pavements are for pedestrians.

Senator L.J. Farnham :

Even if it is 12 feet wide?

The Deputy Bailiff :

You have had your answer. Deputy Young.

10. Deputy J.H. Young of St. Brelade :

Has the Minister considered intensifying the use of the Snow Hill Cut to increase the availability of town parking?

Deputy K.C. Lewis :

Yes, indeed, that has been looked at several times and several plans have been drawn up. There are quite a few constraints with the Snow Hill Cut; I believe it is listed, plus any additional floors put in there would need a very high ceiling because we need to get trucks into the cavern under Fort Regent. So it would not be cost effective, but my officers are looking at several schemes to improve parking at the Snow Hill Cut.

The Deputy Bailiff :

The Connétable of St. Peter , final question.

11. The Connétable of St. Peter :

Has the Minister considered the provision of secure area parking for things like electric cycles, which would encourage people from the northern parishes to come on bikes when they have hills to climb on the way back?

[10:00]

Deputy K.C. Lewis :

Yes, indeed. This is something my department has looked at several times and it is still in the feasibility stage, complete with charging points for small electric cycles.

The Deputy Bailiff :

Final supplementary?

Deputy R.J. Rondel:

I did not realise this question would spark such debate but I will leave it at that. The Deputy Bailiff :

Very well, we come to question 4 which Deputy Young will ask of the Minister for Planning and Environment.

4. Deputy J.H. Young of the Minister for Planning and Environment regarding high density urbanized redevelopment of properties within small built-up areas identified in the Island Plan 2002:

Will the Minister advise the Assembly whether the policies of the Island Plan 2011 discourage or encourage the high density urbanised redevelopment of the properties located within the 16 small built-up areas which were previously identified in the Island Plan 2002 (8 of which are in St. Brelade) which were previously considered to be suitable only for small-scale infill development to minimise the impact of development on the wider countryside?

Deputy R.C. Duhamel of St. Saviour (The Minister for Planning and Environment):

The policies of the Island Plan 2011 do not encourage the high density urbanised redevelopment of properties located within the 16 small built-up areas previously identified in the Island Plan 2002, which includes, for example, areas such as Petit Port Close, Le Clos de l'Atlantique and Parcq de l'Oeillere in St. Brelade . The 2011 Island Plan, however, recognises that we need to make wise and efficient use of the land that is already developed, which includes all sites within defined built-up areas throughout the Island, including St. Brelade. The plan seeks to promote a more sustainable pattern of development for Jersey and is based on a strategy that meets the Island's development needs from within the existing built-up area. The alternative to this, which has been rejected by the Assembly, is to build on greenfield land to meet our development needs. The policies of the new Island Plan, therefore, seek to ensure that the highest reasonable density is achieved for all new development.

1. Deputy J.H. Young:

I thank the Minister for his assurance that they do not encourage the high density but I ask him to clarify whether development of the highest reasonable density means that we are at risk of overdeveloping these areas in order to save greenfield elsewhere. Could he please clarify whether that is the understanding of his answer?

Deputy R.C. Duhamel:

That interpretation is not the interpretation that should be placed on my answer. I go on. The provision of the highest reasonable density of development is not an overriding consideration. A new development in those areas, as elsewhere, needs to be commensurate with good design and must include as part of a balanced decision-making process consideration of all material factors such as the provision of adequate amenity space and parking, the impact upon neighbouring uses and the relationship, importantly, of the development upon its physical context, including its landscape setting and the predominant character of the surrounding area. All of these factors are set out in the policy regime provided in the new Island Plan, specifically policy GD3, Density of Development.

2. Deputy M. Tadier :

The Minister said that the plan does not encourage high density urbanised redevelopment but does he acknowledge that perhaps it encourages urbanisation by stealth? Will he also comment on the fact that at Petit Port we have seen 2 recent developments which have been given planning permission which are not simply in the built-up area but which encroach into the green area, and another 2 which are in the National Park zone?

Deputy R.C. Duhamel:

Specifically, the 16 areas that were referred to in the 2002 Plan were reviewed by Professor McCausland, and a part of that review suggested that one of the things that the plan had particularly provided badly was that there had been sporadic development which had broken out across the Island. By "sporadic development" he meant that there had been a pepper-potting of urban-style housing estates in green open countryside areas. The plan and the policy that have been endorsed by this House are very clear: we are not seeking to encourage an urban style-high-rise kind of development on such areas because that style of development would be out of context specifically with the backdrop of the areas. Indeed, by doing that, not encouraging is also not discouraging. All planning issues have to be weighed-up and balanced against the policy considerations that the department and the officers and the Minister works to. That is what we will do.

3. Connétable S.W. Pallett of St. Brelade :

Does the Minister consider the recent approved application of Petit Port Close, which is one of the 16 sites mentioned, a small-scale infill, and does he consider that it will not impact on the wider countryside?

Deputy R.C. Duhamel:

It is not right for the Minister for Planning and Environment to pass a comment on decisions that have been made by his applications panel or indeed to pick out specific references to particular applications that may be coming back to the Minister for further reconsideration.

4. Deputy J.H. Young:

I thank the Minister for his answers but would the Minister agree that the complexities of the policy which had been adopted in 2001 (he has explained the references to GD1 policies and so on, which are designed to avoid overdevelopment) do require a relook at the planning guidance that he gives so that we can avoid mistakes and overdevelopment happening in these areas? Will he commit to having a detailed look at that, please?

Deputy R.C. Duhamel:

I am in absolute agreement with the Deputy . Within the Island Plan at 1.17 it states: "The Minister for Planning and Environment will develop and issue new supplementary planning guidance to inform the application of minimum density standards," which indeed is the thrust of the policy of GD3. It is my full intention, as has been reported to the Deputy as part of the Scrutiny process, and in this House, that a whole host of supplementary planning guidance notes are being developed as fast as we are able to do so in order to flesh out the proposals and propositions that this House has supported within the Island Plan.

The Deputy Bailiff :

We come now to question 5 which Deputy Trevor Pitman will ask of The Minister for Home Affairs.

5. Deputy T.M. Pitman of the Minister for Home Affairs regarding the resources of the States of Jersey Police to deal with cyber-crime':

Are the States of Jersey Police resourced in the same standard as forces in the U.K. in terms of training in software to deal with so-called cyber crime? I have to say that it would have been more helpful if I had had it on anonymous Internet bullying.

Senator B.I. Le Marquand (The Minister for Home Affairs):

This is quite difficult question to answer because cyber-crime covers a wide area of crime, from paedophilia to financial crime to cyber-bullying. Different police forces prioritise such crimes in different ways, depending upon the perceived threat in their area. Jersey, of course, unlike U.K. mainland police forces, has to respond to the full range of policing threats and issues and does not have the immediate assistance of neighbouring forces or of a serious and organised crime agency. Jersey has built up a combination of expertise in various different parts of the force; in the Hi-tech Crime Unit, in the force Intelligence Bureau and in the Financial Crimes Unit. In addition to this, they have links with other forces and with expert support agencies in the U.K. and there is a continuing training and personal development programme for officers. The majority of current complaints are still managed and dealt with locally. I am, therefore, satisfied that the current level of capacity is sufficient to respond to such crimes.

1. Deputy T.M. Pitman:

I thank the Minister for his answer. I know the Minister did not see it because I asked him, but there was a BBC (British Broadcasting Corporation) documentary on the very issue last night pointing out that vulnerable people and children the world over have ended up taking their own lives due to this. Given the limitations the Minister has acknowledged, could he shed any encouragement on the fact why infamous Internet trials in Jersey, perhaps like Mr. John Howarth who was convicted in the courts and was a notorious bully on the Internet with many complaints made and yet the police were never able to pin this on him, is he really happy that that expertise is there?