States Minutes 24th September 1985

THE STATES assembled on Tuesday, 24th September, 1985 at 10.15 a.m. under the Presidency of the Bailiff ,

Sir Frank Ereaut. ____________

His Excellency The Lieutenant Governor, Admiral Sir William Pillar, G.B.E., K.C.B., was present.

____________

All members were present with the exception of –

Fred Philip Webber Clarke, Connétable of St. Helier – out of the Island.

Enid Clare Quenault, Deputy of St. Brelade – out of the Island.

Donald George Filleul, Deputy of St. Helier – out of the Island.

Robin Ernest Richard Rumboll, Deputy of St. Helier – out of the Island.

Corrie Stein, Deputy of Grouville – out of the Island.

Graham Douglas Thorne , Deputy of St. Brelade – out of the Island.

____________

Prayers ____________

The  Very  Reverend  B.A.  O'Ferrall,  C.B.,  Dean  of  Jersey – welcome.

The Bailiff , on behalf of the Members of the States, welcomed the newly appointed Dean, The Very Reverend Basil Arthur O'Ferrall, C.B.

207   Price : £2.00

Speaker of the House of Commons, the Rt. Hon. B. Weatherill.

The Bailiff welcomed the Speaker of the House of Commons, the Right Honourable Bernard Weatherill, M.P., who occupied a seat on the floor of the House.

The Speaker suitably replied.

Welfare Benefit – revised rates from 1st October, 1985: report. R.C.17.

The Finance and Economics Committee by Act dated 16th September, 1985, presented to the States a Report setting out revised rates of Welfare Benefit from 1st October, 1985.

THE STATES ordered that the said Report be printed and distributed.

Matters noted – land transactions.

THE STATES noted Acts of the Finance and Economics Committee dated 19th August, 2nd and 16th September, 1985, showing that in pursuance of Standing Orders relating to certain transactions in land, the Committee had approved –

1. as recommended by the Public Health Committee, the assignment of the balance of the 21-year lease, approved by the States on 5th June, 1973, which was to expire on 31st May, 1994, with the option to renew for a further 21 years, by The Heart of Variety (Channel Islands) to Les Amis Inc. (the Management Committee of the Jersey Society for Mentally Handicapped Children and Adults Inc.) of the site of Maison Variety, Five Oaks, St. Saviour ;
2. as recommended by the Education Committee, the passing of a contrat de bornement with the undermentioned to ratify boundaries between the new housing development, Le Clos Ahier , St. Saviour , and the playing field and roadway at Highlands, administered by that Committee, subject to all legal fees being paid by the companies –

1. "Le Clos Ahier Development Limited" and/or the owners of Nos. 1 – 6 Le Clos Ahier to confirm that the new walls bordering the properties at Nos. 1,2, 3 and 4 Le Clos Ahier would remain the property in perpetuity, without relief, of the said owners;
2. The Jersey Electricity Company Limited allowing the Company to pass electricity cables in the roadway belonging to the public bordering the Le Clos Ahier development;
3. The Jersey New Waterworks Company Limited allowing that Company to place water pipes in the same road;

3. as recommended by the Education Committee, the passing of a contrat de bornement with Mr. Trevor John Gallichan and Mrs. Joy Dawn Gallichan, née Le Noa, the owners of Caesarea Villa, St. Helier , a property bordering Janvrin School playground partly on the west and partly on the south, in order to establish that –

1. ownership of the walls to both the north and east of Caesarea Villa be regarded as party walls and maintenance a joint responsibility of the Committee and Mr. and Mrs. Gallichan;
2. the Public right of way over the driveway to the north of Caesarea Villa be ceded to Mr. and Mrs. Gallichan;
3. the Public agree to the cancellation ofMr. and Mrs. Gallichan's water rights;

4. the cost of any documentation to be shared equally between the Public and Mr. and Mrs. Gallichan;

4. as recommended by the Education Committee, the renewal of the lease to The Jersey Electricity Company Limited of Sub-Station No. 212, Fairfield Avenue, St. Helier , for a further term of 21 years, commencing 29th September, 1985, at an annual rent of £1;
5. as recommended by the Island Development Committee, the leasing from the Crown of Field No. 1326, Netherton Farm, St. Ouen , by the Public of the Island, for a period of five years, at an annual rent of £100 to enable the creation of a footpath and bridle-path links around the perimeter, and the sub- leasing to Mrs. Roselle Surcouf, née Morin, of the remainder of the field, for the same period, subject to review, at an annual rent of £10;
6. as recommended by the Public Works Committee, the lease to The Jersey Electricity Company Limited of the sub-station site at Patriotic Street multi-storey car park for a term of99 years, at an annual rent of £1 to be paid in total at the time of passing contract;
7. as recommended by the Public Works Committee, the acquisition from Mr. Alexander Dodd of199.1 square feet of land at Maree Haute, St. Brelade 's Bay, required in connexion with the construction of a footpath along the north side of the road through St. Brelade 's Bay at the rate of £2.00 a square foot, namely a consideration of £398.20, on the basis of the Public of the Island assuming responsibility for all the costs involved in the preparation of a contract and, in addition, for all the costs involved in the accommodation works to improve the footpath;

8. as recommended by the Housing Committee, with the support of the Island Development Committee, the purchase from Mr. Stanley Joseph Davy and Mrs. Renée Jermaine Angela Davy, née Forget, of Halcyon House, Westhill, St. Helier , for a consideration of £168,000 for the realty, with each party to be responsible for the payment of its own legal fees. (The Committee rescinded sub- paragraph (d) of Act No. 2 of 28th November, 1984,of the Committee as previously constituted, which had been notified to the States on 4th December, 1984);
9. as recommended by the Public Health Committee, and in pursuance of an Act of the States dated 20th November, 1979, accepting the devise of the late Mrs. Eunice Jane Bailhache , née Hubert, of specified properties, the assignment of the head-lease of the property No. 78, New Street, St. Helier , which was due to expire on 12th May, 1996,by Cozport (Jersey) Limited to Groet Investments Limited;
10. as recommended by the Harbours and Airport Committee, the leasing to Hi-Speed Freight Services Limited of an additional area of 280 square feet of office accommodation on the ground floor of the Freight Terminal Building, Jersey Airport, at an annual rent of £1,330 (a rate of £4.75 a square foot), for the period 1st October, 1984 to 31st March, 1986,on which latter date the company's existing lease agreement would expire;
11. as recommended by the Public Works Committee, the acquisition from St. Helier International Ltd. of657 square feet of land required in connexion with the construction of a footpath along the north side of the road through St. Brelade 's Bay, for a nominal consideration of £10, to include the frontage ofBeau Rivage Hotel staff quarters and also the small area at the southern end of the private right of way leading between the staff quarters and the coach park to the east, and the sale to St. Helier International Ltd. of an equivalent area of land from public holdings lying to the west of the property of Beau Rivage Hotel, also for a nominal consideration of £10, with the Public of the Island being responsible for the payment of legal fees.

Matters noted – financial transactions.

THE STATES noted Acts of the Finance and Economics Committee dated 19th August and 2nd September, 1985, showing that in pursuance of Rule 5 of the Public Finances (General) (Jersey) Rules, 1967, as amended, the Committee had noted that –

1. the Housing Committee had accepted the lowest of four tenders, namely that submitted by C.A. Mauger Limited in the sum of £131,660.00 in a contract period of33 weeks for the construction of two three- bedroomed houses and two one-bedroomed flats at Nos. 1, 3 and 3a Windsor Road, St. Helier ;
2. the Harbours and Airport Committee had accepted the lowest of three tenders, namely that submitted by Thatcher Limited in the revised sum of £54,865.00 in a contract period of12 weeks for the construction of the light industrial workshop unit at La Folie, Portof St. Helier ;
3. the Cottage Homes Committee had accepted the lowest of five tenders, namely that submitted by Hacquoil and Cook Limited in the sum of £34,644.00 in a contract period of12 weeks for improvements to Block K', Victoria Cottage Homes by the addition of en-suite toilets and extra bathrooms;
4. the Resources Recovery Board had accepted the lowest of three tenders, namely that submitted by

E. Flaherty & Co. Ltd. in the sum of £32,923.32 for the extension of the foul sewer to serve Bon Air Lane, St. Saviour ;

5. the Education Committee had accepted the tender submitted by Mr. R. Willder in the sum of £40,312 for the installation of lifts for the disabled at Les Quennevais School.

Matters lodged.

The following subjects were lodged "au Greffe" –

1. Draft Firearms (Jersey) Law, 198 . P.104/85. Presented by the Defence Committee.
2. Gorey Village Development: exchange of land. P.105/85.

Presented by the Island Development Committee.

3. Assisted House Purchase Scheme: transfer of administration. P.106/85.

Presented by the Housing Committee. The States decided to take this subject into consideration on 8th October, 1985.

4. Draft Trade Marks (Amendment No. 2) (Jersey) Law. 198. P.107/85.

Presented by the Finance and Economics Committee.

The following subjects were lodged on 27th August, 1985 –

1. 65-70 Caesarea Court, St. Helier : approval of drawings. P.94/85.

Presented by the Housing Committee.

2. Draft Establishments for Massage or Special Treatment (Licensing) (Amendment No. 2) (Jersey) Law, 198 . P.95/85.

Presented by the Public Health Committee.

3. Broadcasting of the Debate on the Review of Housing Policy. P.96/85.

Presented by Senator Richard Joseph Shenton.

4. Fuel Oil Price s: Committee of Inquiry. P.97/85. Presented by Senator Jane Patricia Sandeman.

The following subjects were lodged on the 10th September, 1985 –

1. Health Services: reciprocal agreement with Australia. P.98/85.

Presented by the Public Health Committee.

2. 70 St. Saviour 's Road, St. Helier : approval of drawings. P.99/85.

Presented by the Housing Committee.

3. Agricultural Industry: continuation of bank interest subsidies. P.100/85.

Presented by the Agriculture and Fisheries Committee.

4. Fort Regent: East Ditch redevelopment. P.101/85. Presented by the Fort Regent Development Committee.
5. States' Meetings: printed record. P.102/85. Presented by Deputy Corrie Stein of Grouville .
6. West Shed, Bellozanne Plant: redevelopment. P.103/85.

Presented by the Resources Recovery Board.

Arrangement of Public Business for Autumn Session.

THE  STATES  decided to take the undermentioned subjects into consideration on –

24th September, 1985

Draft Attendance Allowances (Amendment No. 12) (Jersey) Regulations, 198 . P.90/85.

Lodged : 6th August, 1985.

Social Security Committee.

Draft Health Insurance (Medical Benefit) (Amendment No. 27) (Jersey) Regulations, 198 . P.91/85.

Lodged: 6th August, 1985.

Social Security Committee.

65-70 Caesarea Court, St. Helier : approval of drawings. P.94/85.

Lodged: 27th August, 1985.

Housing Committee.

70 St. Saviour 's Road, St. Helier : approval of drawings. P.99/85.

Lodged: 10th September, 1985.

Housing Committee.

Agricultural Industry: continuation of bank interest subsidies. P.100/85.

Lodged: 10th September, 1985.

Agriculture and Fisheries Committee.

Fort Regent: East Ditch redevelopment. P.101/85. Lodged: 10th September, 1985.

Fort Regent Development Committee.

West Shed, Bellozanne Plant: redevelopment. P.103/85. Lodged: 10th September, 1985.

Resources Recovery Board.

8th October, 1985

Broadcasting of the debate on the Review of Housing Policy. P.96/85.

Lodged: 27th August, 1985.

Senator R.J. Shenton.

22nd October, 1985

States' Meetings: printed record. P.102/85. Lodged: 10th September, 1985.

Deputy C. Stein of Grouville .

29th October, 1985

IN A COMMITTEE OF THE WHOLE HOUSE Review of Housing Policy. P.84/85.

Presented: 30th July, 1985.

Housing Committee.

12th November, 1985

Solvent Abuse: examination of the need for legislation. P.82/85.

Lodged: 23rd July, 1985.

Deputy M.A. Wavell of St. Helier .

Broadcasting of States' Meetings: experiment. P.93/85. Lodged: 20th August, 1985.

Senator J.S. Rothwell.

26th November, 1985

Draft Shops (Sunday Trading) (No. 6) (Jersey) Regulations, 198 . P.72/85.

Lodged: 16th July, 1985.

Tourism Committee.

No dates were fixed for the following –

Draft Fishing Vessels (Safety Provisions) (Jersey) Regulations, 198 . P.66/81.

Lodged: 9th June, 1981.

Harbours and Airport Committee.

Draft Fishing Vessels (Manning) (Jersey) Regulations, 198 . P.71/81.

Lodged: 16th June, 1981.

Harbours and Airport Committee.

Petition with regard to the Sentencing of Persons Convicted in the Police Court. P.80/82.

Lodged: 8th June, 1982 and referred to the Legislation Committee.

Deputy R.W. Blampied of St. Helier .

(Report of the Legislation Committee – P.101/83 refers).

Queen's Road/Rouge Bouillon junction: improvements. P.13/84.

Lodged: 7th February, 1984.

Senator J.P. Sandeman.

Draft Dangerous Buildings and Structures (Jersey) Law, 198 . P.55/84.

Lodged: 8th May, 1984 and referred back to the Committee after debate on 5.6.84.

Island Development Committee.

Public 9-hole golf course. P.121/84. Lodged: 4th September, 1984. Senator J.P. Sandeman.

Draft Video Recordings (Jersey) Law, 198 . P.135/84. Lodged: 25th September, 1984.

Education Committee.

La Longue Caserne: gift to Jersey Heritage Trust. P.136/84.

Lodged: 25th September, 1984.

Public Works Committee.

Public 18-hole golf course, Les Landes, St. Ouen . P.139/84.

Lodged: 25th September, 1984.

Deputy J. Le Gallais of St. Saviour .

Bonding Arrangements for Thrift Clubs on licensed premises. P.147/84.

Lodged: 23rd October, 1984 and taken back on 6th November, 1984.

Deputy G.D. Thorne of St. Brelade .

Draft Amendment (No. ) to the Standing Orders of the States of Jersey. P.151/84.

Lodged: 6th November, 1984 and debated on 11th December, 1984. Paragraph 1.(1) "(1A)" referred back, paragraph 1.(1) "(1B)" defeated.

Senator P.F. Horsfall.

Company and Bankruptcy Legislation. P.159/84. Lodged: 20th November, 1984.

Senator J.P. Sandeman.

Committee of Inquiry into the Franchise (Jersey) Law, 1968. P.168/84.

Lodged: 27th November, 1984.

Deputy T.J. Le Main of St. Helier .

Committee of Inquiry into the Franchise (Jersey) Law, 1968 (P.168/84): amendment. P.170/84.

Lodged: 11th December, 1984.

Finance and Economics Committee.

Public Works Committee – Jersey Heritage Trust: supplementary vote of credit. P.174/84.

Lodged: 11th December, 1984.

Finance and Economics Committee.

100 Halkett Place, St. Helier: transfer of administration. P.19/85.

Lodged: 5th March, 1985.

Public Health Committee.

Draft Licensing (No. 4) (Jersey) Regulations, 198 . P.31/85.

Lodged: 2nd April, 1985.

Tourism Committee.

Electricity Cable Link with France. P.50/85. Lodged: 28th May, 1985.

Deputy R.E.R. Rumboll of St. Helier .

Draft Sewerage (Miscellaneous Provisions) (Jersey) Law, 198 . P.70/85.

Lodged: 9th July, 1985.

Resources Recovery Board.

Welfare Payments: assessments. P.74/85. Lodged: 16th July, 1985.

Senator R.J. Shenton.

Glacis Field, Fort Regent: proposed temporary car park. P.78/85.

Lodged: 16th July, 1985, and deferred after debate on 31/7/85.

Island Development Committee.

States' Trading Activities: investigation. P.89/85. Lodged: 6th August, 1985.

Senator R.J. Shenton.

Dégrèvement procedure: amendment. P.92/85. Lodged: 20th August, 1985.

Senator R.J. Shenton.

Draft Establishments for Massage or Special Treatment (Licensing) (Amendment No. 2) (Jersey) Law, 198 . P.95/85.

Lodged: 27th August, 1985.

Public Health Committee.

Fuel Oil Price s: Committee of Inquiry. P.97/85. Lodged: 27th August, 1985.

Senator J.P. Sandeman.

Health Services: reciprocal agreement with Australia. P.98/85.

Lodged: 10th September, 1985.

Public Health Committee.

Awaiting Reports

Draft Amendment (No. 10) to the Standing Orders of the States of Jersey. P.84/80.

Lodged: 10th June, 1980, and referred to Legislation Committee.

Deputy N.S. Le Brocq of St. Helier .

Draft Protection of Employment Opportunities (Jersey) Law, 198 . P.36/83.

Lodged: 15th March, 1983.

Articles 2, 3, 5 and 7 referred back in Second Reading. Defence Committee.

Draft Parish Rate (Administration) (Amendment No. 5) (Jersey) Law, 198 . P.3/85.

Lodged: 15th January, 1985, and referred to the Finance and Economics Committee.

Deputy D.A. Carter of St. Helier .

Private Hire Cabs Fares: control. P.41/85.

Lodged: 7th May, 1985, and referred to the Defence Committee.

Senator R.J. Shenton.

Fort Regent Membership: petition. P.53/85.

Lodged: 4th June, 1985, and referred to the Fort Regent Development Committee.

Deputy J. Le Gallais of St. Saviour .

Subjects lodged "au Greffe" – withdrawn.

THE STATES noted that the Proposers had withdrawn the following subjects lodged "au Greffe" –

Draft Protection of Employment Opportunities (Jersey) Law, 198 : amendments. P.47/83.

Lodged: 29th March, 1983, and referred to the Defence Committee.

Connétable of St. Saviour .

La Collette Reclamation Site: leases. P.4/85.

Lodged: 15th January, 1985, and deferred on 5th February, 1985.

Harbours and Airport Committee.

Alcoholism. Questions and answers.

Senator Richard Joseph Shenton asked Senator John Le Marquand, President of the Public Health Committee, the following questions –

"1. Would the President inform the House what steps are

being taken to provide suitable accommodation for the large number of homeless alcoholics in the Island?

2. Is the President aware of the number of young people, particularly females, who suffer from alcoholism, and whose only recourse to shelter is to have themselves admitted to prison?
3. Would the President inform the House what steps the Committee is taking to rehabilitate these unfortunate people, or is it the policy of the Committee to leave this matter to voluntary bodies?
4. Has the Committee considered using Haut de la Garenne as a rehabilitation centre and, if not, why not?
5. Would the President confirm that at the present time there are only four beds available for female alcoholics, and that these are usually occupied by long-term sufferers?
6. Would the President inform the House as to the conditions which apply at the male hostel accommodation with regard to facilities and pocket money?
7. Is the President satisfied that the States are doing all they can to alleviate this grave problem?"

The President of the Public Health Committee replied as follows –

"The House will recall that my Committee presented an interim report to the States on the 10th April 1985, relating to the Committee's policy on the problems of alcoholism and indicated that a full report was being prepared and would be presented to the States later in the year. I am now able to advise the House that the report is in the final stages of completion and it is anticipated that it will be lodged in October.

In response to the specific questions of Senator Shenton –

1. Housing the homeless is not the responsibility of the Public Health Committee. Nevertheless, my Committee's report has focused attention on this problem and the importance of discussions between the Housing Committee, the Connétable s and various interested voluntary organisations on the problems of homeless alcoholics. At the present time the New Street Night Shelter, run by the Community Alcohol Team, can accommodate 17 men and 8 women. It caters mainly for those with a drinking problem and will accept non-violent persons who are under the influence'. This is a charity which receives financial help from Public Health, the Housing Department and the St. Helier Welfare Board. Professional supervision is exercised by the Probation Department and the administration is carried out by the Jersey Council on Alcoholism. During the day the building is manned by volunteers as a Day Shelter for the same category of person (average 12 – 13 per day). Margaret House, run by the Jersey Council on Alcoholism, can accommodate 8 recovering alcoholics of both sexes. Accommodation is also provided at Roseneath' under the jurisdiction of the NEMO Trust. This hostel, I understand, can accommodate 20 men, not, of course, necessarily alcoholics.
2. I understand the number of homeless females who have a problem involving the use of alcohol represents a hard core of12. These women range in age from 22 to the early 50s. The average accommodated at the Night Shelter is 5, with the remainder either sleeping in non-permanent accommodation or being in custody. The number of male hard-core alcoholics is approximately 30 with an age range of18 to 70. The New Street Shelter is usually full overnight, mainly from this group.

3. The steps that are being recommended in the Committee's report will include developing the range and nature of treatment facilities in the Island including the development of community- based treatment services, referral to approved treatment centres in the United Kingdom in particular cases, and greater involvement of family doctors and, of course, voluntary organisations such as the Jersey Council on Alcoholism and Alcoholics Anonymous, in this problem. Many of these people, however, have received treatment in hospital, from time to time, for years. Unfortunately, it has been unsuccessful in the majority of cases due to their unwillingness to abide by any reasonable form of treatment or management. It will be understood that treatment and rehabilitation is entirely voluntary.
4. As stated previously, the Committee is persuaded that the care of the alcoholic should principally be a community-based service and that Haut de la Garenne would not, in my Committee's opinion, be suitable as a treatment centre.
5. This is not correct. Patients can be treated on the medical, surgical or psychiatric wards of the General Hospital or at St. Saviour 's Hospital dependent on the nature and extent of their illness.
6. It is understood that the Senator is referring to Roseneath', mentioned previously. It is administered by the Salvation Army. The amount of pocket money is determined by Parish Welfare.
7. No. That is the reason why my Committee organised an Island-wide Seminar in 1984 and has devoted such time and energy to the report on the whole problem which will be lodged in October."

Plants at the Airport. Questions and answers.

Senator Jane Patricia Sandeman asked Senator Bernard Thomas Binnington, President of the Harbours and Airport Committee, the following questions –

"1. Will the President inform the States of the name of the

firm, the cost and the duration of the contract awarded for the provision and maintenance of plants at the Airport?

2.  Will the President give the Committee's reasons for not putting this contract out to tender?"

The President of the Harbours and Airport Committee replied as follows –

"1. The plants which have recently been installed in the

main building, the arrivals corridor and the arrivals hall at the Airport have been supplied by Far-For (Developments) Limited who have provided approximately 200 foliage plants set in a large number of containers, none of these being at any capital cost to the Harbours and Airport Committee.

The plants have been installed on an experimental basis only and the present cost of maintenance with twice weekly servicing visits is approximately £60 per week. The supplier is responsible for the replacement of all plants which are damaged or die off.

No contract has been awarded for the provision or maintenance of these plants as the whole arrangement is, at present, on an experimental basis in order that the  Committee may assess the desirability of using plants for screening and to brighten up what would otherwise be a fairly drab approach to the passenger arrivals area.

The Committee intends to gauge the reaction of the travelling public to the scheme over the next few months. The reaction to date has been very favourable.

2.  When the Committee has considered fully its needs and how best to satisfy them with regard to plants, it may consider the need for placing a more permanent contract out to tender."

Reservoirs. Questions and answers.

Senator Jane Patricia Sandeman asked Deputy John Le Gallais of St. Saviour , Vice-President of the Public Works Committee, the following questions –

"1. Will the President give under the headings requested

the  1985  costs for the construction of the Queen's Valley Reservoir –

1. construction costs;
2. fees;
3. land purchase;
4. costs already incurred by The Jersey New Waterworks Company on this project?

2. Will the President state his source of information for the data supplied to States' Members on a paper entitled Comparison of Costs' which he distributed to Members in the course of his speech on 26th March, 1985 during the debate on the evaluation of Val de la Mare?
3. Will the President inform the States of the rights of Watson Hawksley under the agreement between The Jersey New Waterworks Company and Watson Hawksley to design the Queen's Valley Reservoir if the project should not proceed to completion?"

The Vice-President of the Public Works Committee replied as follows –

"1. (a) The cost for the Civil Engineering contract at

September 1985 figures is estimated at £11,275,000.

This is rather less than a 5 per cent increase on the October 1984 figure of £10,842,000 which was used in the paper entitled Comparison of Costs' distributed to Members of the States on 26th March, 1985.

In addition the estimated cost of the Mechanical and Electrical works is £352,000.

2. The estimate for fees for the complete project is £800,000.
3. Land purchase is subject to negotiation. At this time I can do no better than repeat the figure given in March of£200,000.
4. The costs already incurred by the Company remain as indicated in March, at £860,000.

I would like to emphasise in the first place that some, but not all of the costs incurred to date are in addition to the estimates given in answer to paragraphs (a), (b) and (c) and secondly –

The paper entitled Comparison of Costs' distributed in March comparing the costs for the Val de la Mare and Queen's Valley schemes was based upon estimates regarded as reliable.

The professional fees were not included for either scheme because of the difficulty of calculating those fees in respect of enlarging Val de la Mare while maintaining it in full service.

Similarly, the mechanical and electrical costs were excluded because of the complication in assessing these in the case of Val de la Mare where water would have to be collected in the East of the Island, pumped to Val de la Mare for storage and then returned for treatment prior to distribution.

Nothing I have said in reply to this question alters the fact that in March of this year, the cost difference between the two schemes exceeded £6½ million.

2. The information used in the preparation of the data supplied to States Members in the paper entitled Comparison of Costs' on 26th March, 1985, during the debate on the evaluation of Val de la Mare was obtained from The Jersey New Waterworks Company Limited, Messrs. Watson Hawksley, the Company's Consulting Engineers and the Department of Public Building and Works, which supplied figures for the cost of rock used in land reclamation.
3. The Company entered into a formal agreement with Watson Hawksley on 21st December, 1981. It is the standard agreement between client and consulting engineer for the design and supervision of civil, mechanical and electrical works and the conditions of engagement were those approved by the Council of the Association of Consulting Engineers on 14th December, 1970.

The conditions of engagement include a clause which states the obligations of the client for payment following his termination of the agreement. Upon termination the client shall pay to the consulting engineer a fair and reasonable portion of the sum which would have been payable to him had not termination taken place plus a disruption charge equal to one sixth of the difference between the sum which would have been payable but for the termination and the fair and reasonable proportion assessed above.

The actual sum payable in the event of termination is therefore  open  to  agreement  between  the Company and Watson Hawksley. It is anticipated that the sum involved would be slightly in excess of £100,000 if termination were to take place now."

Supplementary and Additional Votes of Credit.

THE STATES considered an Act of the Finance and Economics Committee  dated  16th  September,  1985,  presenting  Acts  of  the undermentioned Committees and, acceding to the requests contained therein,  granted  to  the  said  Committees  Supplementary (S)  and Additional (A)  votes  of  credit  out  of  the  General  Reserve  as follows –

S  A

£ £

Finance and Economics Committee

Bailiff 's Chambers

0302  Premises  1,300 0305  Establishment  3,300

Crown Officers' Department

0311  Staff  10,100 0312  Premises  500 0313  Supplies and Services  14,300 0315  Establishment  4,800

Police Court

0342  Premises  2,300 0343  Supplies and Services  1,700 0345  Establishment  1,500

Income Tax

0371  Staff  27,000 0372  Premises  7,700 0373  Supplies and Services  4,500

States Greffe

0391  Staff  27,100 States Greffe – Printing Section

0401  Staff  3,700

Commercial Relations

0431  Staff  12,500 0432  Premises   500

Total request  122,800

S  A

£ £

Defence Committee

Miscellaneous

1016  Maintenance of property  5,500 1018  Sundries  1,000

Civil Emergency Office

1051  Staff  800 1055  Establishment  300

Immigration and Nationality

Department

1101  Staff  16,400 Motor Traffic Office

1121  Staff  6,000

Police

1202  Premises  10,000 1203  Supplies and Services  16,800 1204  Transport  4,400 1205  Establishment  14,200 1206  Police Dogs  200

Fire Service

1301  Staff  40,900 Total request  116,500

Public Works Committee

2001  Administration – staff  36,700 2021  Coast Protection – staff  5,000 2031  Car Parks – staff  5,900 2051  Highways, Public Land – staff  10,300 2061  Highways, Public Land,

Beaches and Toilets –

cleaning – staff  21,200 Carried forward  79,100

S  A

£ £

Public Works Committee cont'd.

Brought forward  79,100 2081  Public Buildings – staff  12,200 2082  Public Buildings – premises  24,000 2091  Public Gardens – staff  45,700 2101  Public Markets – staff  2,200 2201  Consumer Advice – staff  600 2301  Weights and Measures –

staff   2,200 Total request  166,000

Education Committee

Scholarships, Grants, and

Advanced Education

2856  Grants to students  76,500

Sheltered Workshop

3110  Sheltered Workshop  20,000 Total request  96,500

Public Health Committee

Grants

3252  Jersey District Nursing

Association  10,000 3253  Jersey Home Helps  50,000

Health and Social Services

3265  Welfare of the Aged

and Infirm  35,000

General Hospital

3402  Premises

3403  Supplies and Services 3406  Hospital Building Survey

Pathological Laboratory

3413  Supplies and Services

Total request £200,000

3,000 33,800

56,000 12,200  

144,000  56,000

S  A

£ £

Resources Recovery Board

Administration

4001  Staff  30,600

Drainage and Waste Disposal

4016  Waste Treatment and

Disposal  34,100 4018  Drainage  29,900

Total request  94,600

Agriculture and Fisheries Committee

Administration

4101  Staff  14,700 4103  Supplies and Services  6,000

Howard Davis Farm

4111  Staff  3,500 Artificial Insemination and Semen

Bank Scheme

4152  Premises  1,200

Emergency Supplies

4162  Premises  100 4166  Buffer Stock Payments   700

Total request  26,200 Tourism Committee

Administration

4601  Staff  11,600

Etat Civil Committee

4702  Premises  1,000 4705  Establishment   800

Total request  1,800

S  A

£ £

Establishment Committee

States Personnel Department,

Employee Relations and

Organization Branches

5101  Staff  5,600 5102  Premises  3,800 5103  Supplies and Services  800 5104  Transport  100 5105  Establishment  1,400 5106  States Training Scheme –

trainees  8,500 5107  States Development and

Training  9,400

Pension and Pension Fund

Contributions

5112  Pensions to unestablished

Officers appointed prior to

1st January, 1946  100 5113  Pensions to retired Public

Service Employees  117,000 Total request  146,700

Housing Committee

Administration

5401  Staff  10,600

States Houses

5411  Staff   8,900 Total request  19,500

Prison Board

Administration

5501  Staff  47,600 5502  Premises  13,000 5503  Supplies and Services  6,900 5504  Transport  100 5505  Establishment  1,900 5507  Staff Housing   200

Total request  69,700

STATES MINUTES

Fort Regent Development Committee

General Overheads

5712  Premises

Gambling Control Committee

5802  Premises

5805  Establishment

24th September, 1985

20,000

600 1,900

Total request  2,500 Policy Advisory Committee

6401  General expenses  500

Harbours and Airport Committee

1706  Airport operating expenses  115,000 Postal Administration Committee

6100  Operating expenses  68,000

CAPITAL VOTES OF CREDIT

Education Committee

C0524  Janvrin School extension  6,000 C0529  Youth Service – Le Squez  3,000 C0598  Mont à l'Abbé School  14,000

Total request  23,000

Resources Recovery Board

C0462  Alterations to West Shed   56,900

Housing Committee

C1103  Purchase, building and

rehabilitation of dwellings  1,101,000 Fort Regent Development Committee

C1219  East Ditch redevelopment  100,000

Harbours and Airport Committee

C0269  Ambulift   45,000

The total requests granted for the September Supply Day amounted to £2,603,800.

The total of deferred Supply items amounted to £1,508,000. Adjournment.

THE STATES, in pursuance of Article 3 of the States of Jersey Law, 1966, adjourned and reassembled under the Presidency of the Greffier of the States, Edward James MacGregor Potter, Esquire.

Defence Committee – Police: staff. Deferred Supply. P.108/85.

THE STATES deferred consideration of the request of the Defence Committee for a supplementary vote of credit in the sum of £168,500 for Police: staff (1201).

The Proposition relative thereto was lodged "au Greffe" by Senator Richard Joseph Shenton. The States decided to take this subject into consideration on 8th October, 1985.

Education Committee – structural maintenance. Deferred Supply. P.109/85.

THE STATES deferred consideration of the request of the Education Committee for a supplementary vote of credit in the sum of £28,500 for general maintenance and emergencies (3096).

The Proposition relative thereto was lodged "au Greffe" by Senator Jane Patricia Sandeman. The States decided to take this subject into consideration on 8th October, 1985.

Overseas Aid Committee – part costs of visit to Africa. Deferred Supply. P.110/85.

THE STATES deferred consideration of the request of the Overseas Aid Committee for a supplementary vote of credit in the sum of £4,500 for part costs of Committee and media representatives visiting Africa (6006).

The Proposition relative thereto was lodged "au Greffe" by Senator Richard Joseph Shenton. The States decided to take this subject into consideration on the 8th October, 1985.

Telecommunications Board – operating expenses and capital servicing. Deferred Supply. P.111/85.

THE STATES deferred consideration of the request of the Telecommunications Board for supplementary votes of credit in the sum of £1,121,500 for operating expenses (4500) and capital servicing (4508B).

The Proposition relative thereto was lodged "au Greffe" by Senator Jane Patricia Sandeman. The States decided to take this subject into consideration on 22nd October, 1985.

Education Committee – Athletics track at F.B. Fields. Deferred Supply. P.112/85.

THE STATES deferred consideration of the request of the Education Committee for a supplementary vote of credit in the sum of £135,000 for revised cost of the synthetic athletics track at the F.B. Fields (C0539).

The Proposition relative thereto was lodged "au Greffe" by Senator Terence John Le Main.

Public Health Committee – General Hospital: electricity supply. Deferred Supply. P.113/85.

THE STATES deferred consideration of the request of the Public Health Committee for a supplementary vote of credit in the sum of £50,000 for the provision of uninterruptable electricity supply equipment for the computers at the General Hospital (C0681).

The Proposition relative thereto was lodged "au Greffe" by Senator Jane Patricia Sandeman.

Les Quennevais Recreation Area: transfer of administration of land.

THE STATES, adopting a Proposition of the Island Development Committee, approved the transfer of 2.85 vergées of land at Les Quennevais Recreation Area as shown on Drawing No. 12.173.1. from the administration of that Committee to that of the Education Committee.

Suspension of Standing Order No. 18.

THE STATES, adopting a Proposition of the Finance and Economics Committee, suspended Standing Order No. 18 in order to allow the Proposition of the Finance and Economics Committee regarding the adoption of the Royal Bank of Scotland (Jersey) Law, 1985 (Appointed Day) Act, 1985, to be considered at the present sitting.

Royal Bank of Scotland (Jersey) Law, 1985 (Appointed Day) Act, 1985.

THE STATES, adopting a Proposition of the Finance and Economics Committee, and in pursuance of Article 1 of the Royal Bank of Scotland (Jersey) Law, 1985 made an Act entitled the Royal Bank of Scotland (Jersey) Law, 1985 (Appointed Day) Act, 1985.

Attendance Allowances (Amendment No. 12) (Jersey) Regulations, 1985. P.90/85.

THE STATES, in pursuance of Articles 2 and 3 of the Attendance Allowances (Jersey) Law, 1973, as amended, made Regulations entitled the Attendance Allowances (Amendment No. 12) (Jersey) Regulations, 1985.

Health Insurance (Medical Benefit) (Amendment No. 27) (Jersey) Regulations, 1985.

THE STATES, in pursuance of Articles 18 and 46 of the Health Insurance (Jersey) Law, 1967, as amended, made Regulations entitled the Health Insurance (Medical Benefit) (Amendment No. 27) (Jersey) Regulations, 1985.

65–70 Caesarea Court, St. Helier : approval of drawings. P.94/85.

THE STATES, adopting a Proposition of the Housing Committee –

1. approved Drawing No. 286/2A showing the construction of six one-bedroomed units of accommodation to form 65-70 Caesarea Court, St. Helier (formerly 22–24 Dorset Street);
2. authorised the Greffier of the States to sign the said Drawing on behalf of the States.

70 St. Saviour 's Road, St. Helier : approval of drawings. P.99/85. THE STATES, adopting a Proposition of the Housing Committee –

1. approved Drawings Nos. 83/13/1b, /06 – /09, /11 – /13 and 14A showing the development at No. 70 St. Saviour 's Road, St. Helier to provide eleven one- bedroomed and one two-bedroomed units of accommodation;
2. authorised the Greffier of the States to sign the said Drawings on behalf of the States.

Agricultural Industry: continuation of bank interest subsidies. P.100/85.

THE STATES, adopting a Proposition of the Agriculture and Fisheries Committee –

1. approved the continuation of the scheme to provide growers with an interest subsidy on monies borrowed from the Clearing Banks and the Trustee Savings Bank of the Channel Islands for the purchase of items used directly in the production and packing of produce, in accordance with the list approved by the Agriculture and Fisheries Committee, the level of the subsidy to be the difference between 6.5 per cent and the individual base rate of the Bank concerned, and the subsidy to apply in respect of interest on borrowings during the period 1st October, 1985, to 30th September, 1986;
2. approved the continuation of a scheme to provide Jersey Exporters Limited with an interest subsidy on monies borrowed from Kleinwort Benson (C.I.) Limited for the financing of the mid potato canning contract, the level of subsidy to be the difference between 6.5 per cent and the effective interest rate of the Bank, and the subsidy to apply in respect of borrowings during the period of 1st July, 1986 to 30th June, 1987;
3. approved the continuation of a scheme to provide glasshouse growers approved by the Agriculture and Fisheries Committee with a subsidy on monies borrowed from Banks to finance the purchase of fuel for glasshouses, the subsidy to be the amount of the interest payable on the monies borrowed if calculated at the base rate of the Bank concerned, and the subsidy to apply to such borrowings after 1st September, 1985 and repaid by 31st July, 1986.

Fort Regent: East Ditch redevelopment. P.101/85.

THE STATES, adopting a Proposition of the Fort Regent Development Committee, agreed to the transfer of the balance of £84,178 from the Capital vote of credit C1204 "General Development 1977" to a new vote of credit C1219 "East Ditch Redevelopment".

West Shed, Bellozanne Plant: redevelopment. P.103/85.

THE STATES, adopting a Proposition of the Resources Recovery Board –

1. approved in principle the scheme for the redevelopment of part of the West Shed at the Bellozanne Plant as a Works Canteen with welfare facilities, as shown on Drawing No. G.1019;
2. authorised the Greffier of the States to sign the said Drawing on behalf of the States.

THE STATES rose at 3.20 p.m.

E.J.M. POTTER, Greffier of the States.