States Minutes 30th July 1996

STATES MINUTES 3 0 th Ju l y 1996   P ri c e : £ 1 . 5 0

T HE STATES assembled on Tuesday, 3 0th July 1996 at 9.30 a.m. under

 the Presidency of the Deputy Bailiff ,

F r ancis Charles Hamon, Esquire

_ _ _ _ _ _ ______

All members were present with the exception of -

S enator Patricia Ann Bailhache - out of the

I sland

C arlyle John Le Herissier Hinault,

C onnétable of St. John - ill

R obin Ernest Richard Rumboll, Deputy of St. H elier - out of the Island

T erence Augustine Le Sueur, Deputy of St. H elier - out of the Island

J ohn Nicolle Le Fondré, Deputy of St.

L awrence - ill

_ _ _ _ _ _ ______

P r a y e rs

_ _ _ _ ________

Matters presented

The following matters were presented to the States -

 1 .  A population policy for Jersey:

W o rking Party report - R.C.20/96.

P r e sented by the Policy and

R e s ources Committee.

T H  E STATES ordered that the said report b e p rinted and distributed.

 2 .  Statistical Review for 1996. P r e sented by the Finance and E c o nomics Committee.

Matters lodged

The following matters were lodged au Greffe'' -

 1 .  Draft Criminal Justice (Evidence

a n d Procedure) (Jersey) Law 199  - P . 1 22/96.

P r e sented by the Legislation

C o m mittee.

 2 .  Jurats' costs in disallowed

r e m ises de biens: (a) Loi (199 )

( A m endement) sur les remises de biens ( b ) Bankruptcy (Désastre) (Amendment N o . 3) (Jersey) Law 199 - P.123/96

( R e vised).

P r e sented by the Legislation

C o m mittee.

 3 .  Joint Advisory Council:

c o n stitution and terms of reference ( P .1 09/96): amendment - P.126/96 ( R e vised).

P r e sented by Senator T.J. Le

M  a in.

Arrangement of public business for the present meeting

THE STATES acceded to the request of the President of the Finance and Economics Committee that consideration of the proposition regarding

the constitution and terms of reference of the

Joint Advisory Council (P.109/96 - lodged au Greffe'' on 9th July 1996) be deferred to a

later date.

Arrangement of public business for an extraordinary meeting on 3rd September 1996

THE STATES acceded to the request of the President of the Finance and Economics Committee that consideration of the remaining Articles of

the draft Limited Liability Partnerships

(Jersey) Law 199 (P.84/96 - lodged au

Greffe'' on 21st May 1996) be deferred from the present meeting and agreed to meet on 3rd September 1996 to consider this matter. On the proposition of Deputy Philip John Rondel of St. John , the amendments relative thereto presented

by Deputy Gary Matthews of St. Brelade were lodged au Greffe'' (P.124/96 (Revised)). Form of contracts used in public civil engineering construction works - questions and answers (Tape No. 353)

Deputy Philip John Rondel of St. John

asked Deputy Derek André Carter of St. Helier, President of the Public Services Committee, the following questions -

1.  W ill the President confirm that

th e sp e cifications for the Yacht

M  arina Project west of Albert Pier

    w e r e d rawn up on the standard form

o f c o n tract that is used in all

p u b li c civil engineering

co n s t ru ction works in the Island?

 2 .  If the answer to 1. is in the

a f fi rmative, will the President explain

w  h y the contractor, and ultimately the

t a xp ayer, has to supply a boat and four 4 x 4 vehicles, office furniture and

c e rt ain items of surveying equipment to t h e resident engineering staff on this

si te when the Public Services

D  ep artment has much of this equipment t o c all on within its Department?''

The President of the Public Services Committee replied as follows -

1.  T he specification for the west of

A l b er t Pier Yacht Marina was

p re p a r ed in the Public Services

D e p a rt ment and utilises the ICE

6 th E d ition (Institution of Civil

E n g in e ers, Conditions of Contract 6 th E d ition). This is a standard

d o cu m  ent used in most major civil en g i n e ering contracts in the

Is l an d .

 2 .  The short answer to the Deputy 's

q u e stion is that to carry out the works e f fi ciently it is necessary to have the p l an t and equipment specified.

T h e detailed answer is -

( a ) A boat (which remains the property

o f th e contractor) is supplied for

jo i n t u se with the contractor.

It i s u s ed for inspection of

w o r k s, i.e. turbidity readings and m o n i to r buoys, etc. and for

tr a n sp o rting of men and equipment to se c t ions of work that will be

in a c c e ssible at certain times,

d u ri n g the extent of the contract.

T h e b o at is a 14 foot dory type w i th o utboard engine.

( b ) The 4 x 4 vehicles are for use on

th e si te and are employed during a 2 4 h o u r day depending on the state

o f th e tide. They are Land Rovers,

as ru g g ed vehicles are necessary

an d f o ur wheel drive needed as

th e y ar e used for long periods on

th e b ea ch. They are used for

tr a n sp o rting equipment,

in s tr u m ents and personnel from the si te o f fices to various areas

ar o u n d this large site. These

v eh i c le s also remain the property

o f th e contractor.

B y c omparison, the harbour

ro a d - w orks project, which was less th a n h alf the value of this

p ro j e c t, specified two 4 x 4

v eh i c le s and an estate car.

S p e ci f ication done by Ove-Arup an d s ta ff numbers decided by

co n s u l tants.

( c ) The office furniture is standard -

d es k s , chairs, filing cabinets and

d ra w  in g boards, commensurate with a m  aj o r civil engineering project.

( d ) The surveying equipment provided is n o t a vailable from within the

D e p a rt ment. The equipment held at P u b li c Services is utilised

th r o u g hout the day and the

re q u i re ment of a major site cannot

b e h e ld up due to the non-

av a i la b ility of equipment at

ce r t ai n times.

It s h o u ld be borne in mind that D e p u ty Rondel was given

in f o rm  ation in a letter dated 24th M a y fr om Professor Mulready re l a ti n g to the four wheel drive v eh i c le s and, if he wished to

d is c u s s further any matters, was as k e d to contact the Chief

E x e c u tive Officer of the

D e p a rt ment.''

Draft Limited Liability Partnerships (Jersey) Law 199  - statement

Senator Reginald Robert Jeune made a personal statement in the following terms -

  My only involvement in the matter of the

   d rafting of the Limited Liability

 P artnerships Law arises out of a meeting of  t he Policy and Resources Committee, dated  2 8th November 1995, when Mr. Richard

 S yvret, Director, Financial Services

 D epartment and the Law Draftsman came to  d iscuss an item on the agenda relating to

 j udicial fees legislation. Mr. Syvret then

 r aised a matter related to a Limited

 L iability Partnerships Law.

I must remind the House that the minutes of t he Policy and Resources Committee are

d istributed to all members and there is

c ontained in the minutes of that day a

r ecord of this matter.

M r. Syvret informed the Policy and

R esources Committee that a large United K ingdom finance institution was interested i n extending its activities in Jersey, and

i t had offered to draft a limited

p artnerships law at its own expense. The

d raft Law would, he said, need to be

a pproved by the Law Draftsman, but it was u nderstood that work involved in checking t he draft Law and making sure that it

c onformed to local systems, should not be

o nerous and would not, therefore,

s ignificantly affect the 1996 Law Drafting P rogramme.

T he Policy and Resources Committee was i nformed by Senator P.F. Horsfall, whose C ommittee had already agreed to proceed w ith this Law, that the Finance and

E conomics Committee believed there were s ubstantial economic benefits for the

I sland and he stressed the limited impact

o n law drafting.

O n the basis of this information the Policy a nd Resources Committee approved the r equest, but the Law Draftsman was

r equested to report back to the Policy and

R esources Committee if the impact on the

1 996 Programme was likely to be increased.

A t no time during that meeting were any

r eports or correspondence produced nor any i ndication given that Messrs. Mourant, du

F eu and Jeune , on behalf of their clients,

h ad written to the President of the Finance

a nd Economics Committee asking that

C ommittee for its agreement to the proposed L imited Liability Partnerships Law.

I saw this discussion entirely as an inter-

C ommittee one, the Finance and Economics C ommittee having already decided on the

p rinciple. In my judgment the role of the

P olicy and Resources Committee that day was s imply to consider the impact on the Law

D rafting Programme. And it was only when

t he Committee was assured that any

i nterference would not affect the other

l egislation on the Programme that they

a greed.

I appreciate the genuine and serious

c oncern that exists among States' members

r egarding the drafting of this Law and I am b ound to say with the benefit of hindsight,

t hat if the Policy and Resources Committee h ad known on 28th November that the law

d rafting requirement was to be as great as

i t proved to be, the Committee I am sure

w ould have applied to the request of the

F inance and Economics Committee a similar p rocedure to that which was set out in the

s tatement I made to the House on 16th

J anuary this year.

A lthough I had heard that Messrs. Mourant, d u Feu and Jeune were part of a large team

o f professionals looking into this matter,

I was not aware of their role nor that they

w ere responsible for the initiating letter

t o the Finance and Economics Committee

a cting for their client. In fact the first

t ime I became aware of its existence was

e xactly one week ago when Deputy Gary

M atthews produced what I understand to be a c opy of the letter addressed to the

P resident of the Finance and Economics

C ommittee. And to this day I have not

a ctually read the letter.

F inally, may I say that I ceased to be a

p artner of Messrs. Mourant, du Feu and

J eune over ten years' ago and have nothing w hatsoever to do with the management or

o perations of the firm. I do receive a

p ension from the firm and, as members are w ell aware, I have the benefit of an office a nd the use of a secretary to carry out my S tates work.

A lthough I am described as a consultant, as i s the practice in professional firms when

p artners of long standing retire, I cannot

r ecall when I was last consulted by any of t he present partners.

I can assure the House that these unfounded a llegations have caused me great distress.

I have been 34 years a member of this House d uring which time I have been called upon

t o make many decisions. I have always

s triven to be meticulous concerning

d eclarations of interest, and I feel sure

t hat all those who have served on

C ommittees with me and officers would

t estify to this fact. During all these

y ears I believe that I have always acted in

g ood faith and in the best interests of our

I sland.''

Senator S. Syvret - allegations

The President read a letter dated 25th July 1996, which the Bailiff had sent to Senator Stuart Syvret in the following terms -

  The States Greffe has produced at my

 r equest a transcript of your intervention

 a t the beginning of the debate on the draft

 L imited Liability Liability Partnerships

 L aw on Tuesday. I enclose a copy herewith  a nd would draw your attention to the

p assage which reads -

S e nator Jeune has, in his capacity as

P r e sident of the Policy and Resources

C o m mittee, used his influence to speed u p the Law Drafting process and get

t h is matter brought through. He has

s p o ken on this matter in the House and a t C ommittee meetings, even though he h a s a financial interest in this

m  at ter.'

T hese remarks constitute serious

i mputations upon the character of a member

o f the States. Allegations of this kind

u nder the cloak of parliamentary privilege

s hould not be made unless the member

c oncerned is able to substantiate them. I

m ust therefore ask you to let me have, by

c lose of business tomorrow, Friday, 26th

J uly, a copy of the evidence upon which you r elied in making those allegations.''

The President called on Senator Syvret to withdraw his accusations against Senator Jeune and to make an apology. Senator Syvret refusing to comply with this request the President, in accordance with Standing Order No. 30(3), ordered Senator Syvret to withdraw from the precincts of the Chamber.

Bovine Spongiform Encephalopathy (BSE) - carcass cremator - statement

The President of the Finance and Economics Committee made a statement in the following terms -

  The Finance and Economics Committee

 c onsidered at its meeting yesterday an

 u rgent request from the Agriculture and

 F isheries Committee to make funds available  i mmediately in connexion with the BSE

 s laughter policy to provide for the

 c onstruction and the equipment of a carcass disposal building, the estimated capital

c ost of which amounts to £315,000. It also

 s tudied details of the other estimated

 c osts in connexion with the BSE slaughter

 p olicy and will bring suitable propositions

 t o the States at its first meeting in

 S eptember.

T he Finance and Economics Committee learned t hat the current carcass incinerator at Le

R ondin Farm is now at the end of its useful

l ife and needs to be replaced. The Public

S ervices Department has confirmed that the

n ew clinical incinerator to be installed at

B ellozanne does not have sufficient

c apacity to deal with the volume or size of

a nimal carcasses which will require

d estruction.

T he Finance and Economics Committee is s atisfied there is a very urgent need to

p rogress work on the new, purpose-built

c arcass cremator and is making available at

o nce to the Agriculture and Fisheries C ommittee £315,000 from its Contingencies V ote.

F ull details of the scheme will be

p resented to the States when the request f or an additional vote of credit and a

s upplementary vote of credit in respect of c ompensation costs, etc. is brought to the S tates at its first meeting in September.''

Portelet headland, St. Brelade: purchase of land

THE STATES, adopting a proposition of the Planning and Environment Committee, rescinded their Act dated 30th April 1996 and -

 ( a) approved the purchase, on behalf of the p u b lic, of approximately 56 vergées of

l a nd at Portelet, St. Brelade, as shown

o n drawing No. 512/1, from Mr. Ian

D o uglas Parker and Mrs. Hazel Josephine P a r ker, née Cashmen, for £50,000 (fifty

t h o usand pounds) the public being

r e sp onsible for the payment of all

l e ga l expenses incurred by the vendors

u p to a maximum amount of £2,000 (two t h o usand pounds);

 ( b) authorised the Greffier of the States t o s ign the said drawing on behalf of t h e States;

 ( c) authorised the Attorney General and the G  re ffier of the States to pass on

b e h alf of the public any contract that

i t m ight be found necessary to pass in

c o n nexion with the acquisition of the

s a id land, and any interest therein;

 ( d) authorised the payment or discharge of t h e expenses to be incurred in

c o n nexion with the acquisition of the

l a nd and all interests therein from the

P l a nning and Environment Committee's c a p ital vote of credit Acquisition of

L a n d - Major Reserve' (Vote C0904).

Belle Vue Pleasure Park and Fields 91, 91A and 92, St. Brelade : development - P.72/96

THE STATES, adopting a proposition of the Planning and Environment Committee, referred to their Act dated 31st July 1990 in which they approved the rezoning of land comprising Belle Vue Pleasure Park and Fields 91 and 91A, St. Brelade , for the purpose of category A' housing development and, if appropriate, for small scale community facilities, and their Acts dated 14th March 1995 approving the rezoning of Fields 89 and 90, St. Brelade, for recreation and amenity use, and 21st November 1995 designating part of Fields 93 and 94, St. Brelade , for use as a cemetery, and -

( a) authorised the Planning and Environment C o m mittee to carry out works of

l a nd scaping and infrastructure required

f o r the development of the said area of

l a nd , as shown on drawing No.485/1 A;

a n d authorised the Greffier of the

S t a tes to sign the said drawing on

b e h alf of the States;

( b) authorised the Finance and Economics C o m mittee to make available bridging f in a nce under Article 7(1)(e) of the

P u b lic Finances (Administration)

( J er sey) Law 1967, as amended, for the c a rr ying out of the said works;

( c) charged the Planning and Environment C o m mittee, with the agreement of the

F i n ance and Economics and Housing

C o m mittees, to enter into agreements

w it h -

( i) housing trusts for the purpose of co n s t ru cting category A' houses fo r r e n t;

( ii ) private developers for the purpose

o f c o n structing category A'

h o u se s for first-time buyers;

 ( d) authorised such sales or leases of land t o s uch trusts or developers as were

a p p ropriate to give effect to such

a g r eements;

 ( e) authorised the Attorney General and the G  re ffier of the States to pass on

b e h alf of the public any contracts, and

t h e Greffier of the States to sign any

a g r eements, that it might be found

n e c essary to pass or sign, as the case

m  ay be, in connexion with the said

d e v elopment;

 ( f) authorised the Treasurer of the States t o r eceive any payments to the public

a s t hey became due. Chelsea Flower Show - P.104/96

THE STATES rejected a proposition of Deputy Alan Breckon of St. Saviour that -

 ( 1) the Island of Jersey should be promoted a t t he Chelsea Flower Show;

 ( 2) the promotion should be done jointly by t h e Agriculture and Fisheries and

T o u rism Committees;

 ( 3) funds should come from existing

C o m mittee budgets if necessary with the a s s istance of the Audit

C o m mittee/Commission.

Members present voted as follows -

P o u r '' (6) Senator

 C hinn. Connétable  T rinity. Deputies

C arter(H), Johns(H), Breckon(S), H uet(H).

C o n tre'' (38) Senators

S henton, Jeune , Horsfall, Rothwell, Le M ain, Le Maistre, Stein, Quérée, Tomes.

Connétable s

S t. Clement, St. Mary, St. Brelade , St. P eter, St. Helier , St. Saviour , St. Martin, S t. Ouen.

Deputies

W avell(S), Norman(C), H. Baudains(C), S t. Ouen, Coutanche(L), Huelin(B), St. M ary, S. Baudains(H), Le Geyt(S),

W alker(H), Crespel(H), Pullin(S), Trinity , D uhamel(S), Matthews(B), Routier(H),

D orey(H), Layzell(B), Grouville , St.

M artin, St. John.

States' Members Remuneration Board: membership - P.105/96 and P.125/96

THE STATES commenced consideration of a proposition of the House Committee and agreed to appoint the following as Chairman and members of the States' Members Remuneration Board -

T wo former States members -

J o h n Clark Averty, Chairman T e r ence Ahier Jéhan

r epresentative of the Jersey Trades C ouncil -

A  n drew John Walker Hamilton

r epresentative of the Jersey Chamber of C ommerce -

R o b ert Henry Henkhuzens

r epresentative of the Institute of D irectors -

G  eo rge McDonald Thain

r epresentative of the Standing Conference

o f Women's Organisations -

M  r s. Daphne Joan Minihane, M.B.E., née N  o el.

Members present voted as follows -

P o u r'' (38) Senators

J eune, Horsfall, Rothwell, Le Main, Q uérée, Chinn, Tomes.

Connétable s

S t. Clement, St. Lawrence, St. Mary, St. B relade, St. Helier, St. Saviour , St.

M artin, St. Ouen.

Deputies

W avell(S), Norman(C), St. Peter ,

H . Baudains(C), St. Ouen, Coutanche(L), H uelin(B), St. Mary, S. Baudains(H), L e Geyt(S), Walker (H), Crespel(H),

P ullin(S), Trinity , Carter(H), Johns(H), D uhamel(S), Routier(H), Dorey(H),

L ayzell(B), Breckon(S), Grouville , St. M artin.

C o n tre'' (8) Senatorsa

 S henton, Le Maistre, Stein. Connétable s

 G rouville, Trinity .

Deputies

M atthews(B), Huet(H), St. John.

On the proposition of Deputy Derek Ryder Maltwood of St. Mary , the States agreed to defer consideration of the remainder of the

proposition, namely the appointment to the Board of members of the public not representing any particular organisation, from the present

meeting to a later date. On the proposition of Senator Jean Amy Le Maistre, amendments of the proposition of the House Committee presented by Deputy Philip John Rondel of St. John were lodged au Greffe'' (P.125/96).

Amendment (No. 17) of the Standing Orders of the States of Jersey - P.113/96

THE STATES, in pursuance of Article 27 of the States of Jersey Law 1966, made amendments of the Standing Orders of the States of Jersey entitled Amendment (No. 17) of the Standing Orders of the States of Jersey.

Jersey Arts Trust: future funding - P.114/96

THE STATES, adopting a proposition of the Finance and Economics Committee -

( 1) approved an increase of £82,000 in the a n n ual revenue grant to the Jersey Arts T r u st with effect from 1st January

1 9 9 7;

( 2) approved the immediate capital grant of £ 1 million to the Jersey Arts Trust for t h e adaptation of the former St. James' C h u rch and Vicarage for arts purposes a s o utlined in the Trust's Business P l a n.

Jersey Law Commission: establishment  P.102/96

THE STATES, adopting a proposition of the Legislation Committee -

( a) approved the establishment of a Jersey L a w Commission as outlined in the

r e p ort of the Legislation Committee,

d a te d 20th May 1996;

( b) appointed the following persons to act a s C hairman and members of the Law C o m mission -

A d vocate Keith Sherwood Baker - C h a irman

J u r at Donald Edward Le Boutillier M  r . David Lyons

( c) authorised the Finance and Economics C o m mittee to make the necessary

f in a ncial resources available.

THE STATES rose at 1.05 p.m.

  G  .H  .C . C  O P P O  C K G  re f fi e r o f the States.