States Minutes 13th May 1997

STATES MINUTES 1 3 t h M  a y 1 997   P ri c e : £ 3 . 0 0

T HE STATES assembled on Tuesday, 1 3th May 1997 at 9.30 a.m. under

t h e Presidency of the Bailiff ,

S ir P  hilip Bailhache

    _ _ _ _ _ _ ______

All members were present with the exception of -

A lastair John Layzell, Deputy of S t. Brelade - out of the Island.

_ _ _ _ _ _ ______

P r a y e rs

_ _ _ _ _ _ ______

Tribute to the late Mr. A.T. Chamier, former Member of the States

The Bailiff paid tribute to the late Mr. Anthony Trenham Chamier, a former Deputy and Connétable of Grouville .

THE STATES observed one minute's silence as a mark of respect.

Subordinate legislation tabled

The following enactments were laid before the States, namely -

 1 .  Disability Transport Allowance

( G e neral Provisions) (Jersey) Order 1 9 9 7. R & O 9080.

 2 .  Collective Investment Funds

( P e rmit Fees) (No. 2) (Jersey) Order 1 9 9 7. R & O 9081.

 3 .  Matrimonial Causes (Amendment N  o . 5) (Jersey) Rules 1997.

R & O 9082.

 4 .  Food Hygiene (General

P r o visions) (Amendment No. 4) (Jersey) O  rd er 1997. R & O 9083.

 5 .  Import and Export (Control)

( A m endment No. 5) (Jersey) Order 1997. R & O 9084.

Matters presented

The following matters were presented to the States -

1 . Ecology Fund: Report for 1996 - R . C .25/97.

P r e sented by the Planning and

E n v ironment Committee.

 2 .  International Conventions and

A g reements: progress report for the p e r iod ended 30th March 1997 -

R . C .26/97.

P r e sented by the Policy and

R e sources Committee.

 3 .  Draft Natwest Offshore Limited

( J er sey) Law 199 (P.67/97): comments - P . 7 2/97.

P r e sented by the Finance and

E c o nomics Committee.

 4 .  Supermarket on Fields 24-27, St.

B r e lade: petition (P.25/97) - report - P . 7 5/97.

P r e sented by the Harbours and

A  ir port Committee.

THE STATES ordered that the said reports be printed and distributed.

The following matter was presented to the States on 29th April 1997 -

 D epartment of Postal Administration:  r eport and accounts for 1996.

 P resented by the Committee for

P o s tal Administration.

Matters noted - land transactions

THE STATES noted an Act of the Finance and Economics Committee dated 28th April 1997, recording the following decisions of the Treasurer of the States under delegated powers, in pursuance of Standing Orders relating to certain transactions in land -

 ( a) as recommended by the Planning and

E n v ironment Committee, the lease from D  r. John Thomas Renouf , junior, of the

4 / 5 bedroom (j)' category property

k n o wn as Maison Petit Port, La Route du P e t it Port, St. Brelade, required in

o r d er to accommodate a Senior Planner

o f t he Planning and Building Services

D  ep artment, for a period of five years

f ro m 1st April 1997, at a commencing

a n n ual rent of £13,000 with an annual

r e v iew in line with the Jersey Retail

P r ic es Index, on the basis that each

p a r ty would be responsible for its own

l e ga l costs arising from the

t ra n saction;

 ( b) as recommended by the Planning and

E n v ironment Committee, the sub-lease to t h e Jersey Brook Advisory Service of

t h e first floor of Axminster House,

D  ev onshire Place, St. Helier, for a

p e r iod of nine years from 1st January

1 9 9 7 at an annual rent of £10,200, with

a t h ree yearly open market review, on

t he basis that each party would be

r e sp onsible for its own legal costs

a r is ing from the transaction;

 ( c) as recommended by the Harbours and

A  ir port Committee, the extension of the l e as e to Lynx Express Delivery Network L i m ited of freight bays Nos. 7 and 8 at

J e rs ey Airport Freight Terminal, for a

p e r iod of three years from 1st January

1 9 9 7, at a total annual rent of

£1 3 ,564.80 (representing £6,782.40 for

e a c h bay), to be reviewed annually on

1 s t January, on the basis that these

a r ra ngements would be subject to the

c o n dition that the lease would not be

r e n ewed upon termination of the period u n l ess it could be demonstrated that at

l e as t 75 per cent of the business

c o n ducted in the premises was related

t o a ir freight;

 ( d) as recommended by the Harbours and

A  ir port Committee, the extension of the

l e as e to G.P. Express (C.I.) Limited of

t w o freight bays known as Lettings B120

a n d B121 and office accommodation known

a s L ettings B133 and B134 at Jersey

A  ir port Freight Terminal, for a period

o f t hree years from 1st January 1997,

a t a total annual rent of £14,663.08

( re p resenting £5,443.20 for each of

B 1 2 0 and B121, £1,938.60 for B133 and

£1 , 838.08 for B134), to be reviewed

a n n ually on 1st January;

 ( e) as recommended by the Planning and

E n v ironment Committee, consent to the s h a re transfer between Hout Holdings

L i m ited and Eden Consultants Limited in r e sp ect of 3A Hue Street, St. Helier ,

f o r a consideration of £70,000 between

t h e parties, on the basis that there

w  as to be no distinction between the

s a le of residential or commercial

a c c ommodation;

 ( f) as recommended by the Education

C o m mittee, the grant of a wayleave to

M  r . Roger Quail, of Les Ruelles, Rue du M  o nt Pellier, Trinity , in order that he

m  ig ht connect his property to the mains w  at er supply across land which formed p a r t of Trinity School in return for a

s in g le payment of £500, on the basis

t h at Mr. Quail would be responsible for b o t h parties' reasonable legal costs

a n d for the reinstatement of all

d i st urbed surfaces to the satisfaction

o f t he Committee;

 ( g) as recommended by the Health and Social S e r vices Committee, the sale to Mrs.

K  at hryn Florence Squire, of La Blanche

M  a ison, Five Oaks, St. Saviour , of a

s tr i p of land (measuring approximately

3 0 0 square feet) to the north of Les

A  m is, Five Oaks, St. Saviour, for the

s u m of £300, on the basis that each

p a r ty would be responsible for its own

l e ga l costs arising from the

t ra n saction;

 ( h) as recommended by the Harbours and

A  ir port Committee, the lease from Mr.

A  rt hur Philip Querée of the three-

b e d room (j)' category property

B a m field, La Route D'Ebenezer, Trinity , r e q uired to accommodate the Assistant

D  iv isional Officer, Airport Fire

S e r vice, for a period of three years

f ro m 1st May 1997, at an annual rent of

£1 1 ,640, subject to annual review

h a v ing regard to the Jersey Retail

P r ic es Index, with both parties having t h e right to break the lease after 18

m  o nths' having given six months'

n o t ice, on the basis that each party

w  o uld be responsible for its own legal c o s ts arising from this transaction.

( T h e Committee accordingly rescinded i ts A ct No. 2(b) of 24th March 1997);

 ( i) as recommended by the Education

C o m mittee, a Deed of Arrangement with U p hill Properties Limited in respect of

a b l ock of apartments presently under

c o n struction adjacent to the eastern

b o u ndary of Seaton Youth Club, St.

H  el ier, in order to confirm the

b o u ndary between the two properties and t o g rant access rights to permit

b u i lding to be undertaken against the

e x is ting gables and walls and to gain

a c c ess to the Youth Club premises,

s u b ject to no such access being

e x e rcised without prior written notice

o f a n agreed period, and with the

p u b lic not being prevented from

r e d eveloping the Youth Club premises,

o n the basis that the company would be

r e sp onsible for both parties' legal

c o s ts and for any damage caused to

S e a ton Youth Club;

 ( j) as recommended by the Harbours and

A  ir port Committee, the sale by way of

e x c hange to the Parish of St. Peter of

l a nd to the north of the new boundary

f e n ce of the airfield which was

r e q uired for the establishment of a

f o o tpath, for a nominal sum of £10, and b y counter-exchange, the purchase from t h e Parish of St. Peter of the site of

t h e former La Rue du Mont au Guet',

f o r the nominal sum of £10, on the

b a s is that each party would be

r e sp onsible for its own legal costs

a r is ing from the transaction.

Matters lodged

The following matters were lodged au Greffe'' -

1 .  Draft Policing of Parks

( A m endment No. 12) (Jersey) Regulations 1 9 9 - P.68/97.

P r e sented by the Public Services

C o m mittee.

2 . 100 Halkett Place, St. Helier : s a le - P.69/97.

P r e sented by the Planning and E n v ironment Committee.

 3 .  Contract lease properties: sale

o f f reehold - P.70/97.

P r e sented by the Housing

C o m mittee.

4 . Bequest of the late Mr. H.E. Le S e e lleur - P.71/97.

P r e sented by the Health and

S o c ial Services Committee.

 5 .  Draft Health Insurance

( A m endment No. 9) (Jersey) Law 1996 ( A p pointed Day) Act 199 - P.73/97.

P r e sented by the Employment and

S o c ial Security Committee.

The following matter was lodged au Greffe'' on 6th May 1997 -

 D raft States of Jersey (Amendment  N o. 6) Law 199  - P.74/97.

 P resented by the Policy and

R e s ources Committee.

Arrangement of public business for the next meeting on 20th May 1997

THE STATES confirmed that the following matters lodged au Greffe'' would be considered on 20th May 1997 -

S tates of Jersey Airport: operation of jet a ircraft - P.24/97.

L odged: 18th February 1997.

H arbours and Airport Committee.

S tates of Jersey Airport: operation

o f jet aircraft (P.24/97) - amendment - P .65/97.

L odged: 22nd April 1997.

T ourism Committee.

H aut de la Garenne, St. Martin :

c onversion and redevelopment - P.64/97. L odged: 22nd April 1997.

P lanning and Environment Committee.

D raft Natwest Offshore Limited (Jersey) Law 199  - P.67/97.

S enator C. Stein.

D raft Natwest Offshore Limited

( Jersey) Law 199 (P.67/97): comments - P .72/97.

P resented: 13th May 1997.

F inance and Economics Committee.

D raft States of Jersey (Amendment N o. 6) Law 199  - P.74/97.

L odged: 6th May 1997

P olicy and Resources Committee.

Audit Commission: appointment - P.59/97 and Bailiff 's Consultative Panel: States nominees - P.61/97

THE STATES acceded to the request of the President of the Finance and Economics Committee that the propositions regarding the Audit Commission and the Bailiff 's Consultative Panel

be taken as the first items of matters lodged

under Public Business at the present meeting.

Tax liability - answer (Tape No. 390)

Senator Frank Harris on Walker , President of the Finance and Economics Committee, replied to a question concerning tax liability asked in the House on 22nd April 1997 by Senator Stuart Syvret as follows -

T a x liabilities by industry  ( rounded to nearest thousand)

1 9 9 2 1 993 1 994

1. Agriculture £1,442,000 £1,093,000 £1,345,0 00
2. Quarrying Information not provided (included underthe heading for construction industry).

4. Manufacturing £922,000 £1,014,000 £1,202,0 00
5. Electricity gas and water supply Information not provided (not all these accountsare

published).

6. ConstructionThese figures include all

building and construction and allied trades (such as shopfitting and signwriting)

together with engineering and quarrying

£ 4 ,2 7 4 , 0 00 £4,867,000 £4,126,0

00

7. Wholesale and Retail £9,664,000; £8,658,000;

£ 7 , 7 2 8 ,6 11.

8. Hotels and restaurants These figures include guest houses, cafés and public houses as well

£ 3 ,8 7 4 , 0 00 £3,743,000 £3,821,0

00

9. Transport and communication including travel agents

£ 1 ,1 8 6 , 0 00 £1,050,000 £973,000

10. F in a n c i al

intermediation £102,745,000 £100,536,000 £102 ,395,000

11. Real Estate The1995 index breaks this down into three categories

1. Developmentand selling ofreal

es t a te. These figures are included at 6 a b ove under the heading for

C o n struction.

2. Letting ofownproperty.As explained

in th e covering letter, tax on income

fr o m letting property is part and

p ar c el of all the tax liabilities

g iv e n elsewhere in this answer. A

ro u g h estimate of the amount of those li a b ilities which arises by reason of

th e i nclusion of property income is

£6 ,8 0 2 , 0 0 0 £7,159,000 £7,72

6 ,0 0 0

3. Real estate activities on a feeor

co n t ract basis

£ 1 5 9 ,0 0 0 £ 119,000 £141,000

12. Public administration and defence No figures

- see covering letter.

13. EducationNo figures - see covering letter.

 Information not provided for the small

 number of people who run private educational  establishments.

14. Healthand social workNo figures forthese services provided by the States - see

 covering letter. The figures for private

 providers are

£1 ,1 8 8 , 0 0 0 £1,389,000 £1,495

,0 0 0

15. Other community social and personal services  No figures for theseservices provided by

the States - see covering letter.

1. Otherbusiness activities (Section J

N o . 74 of the 1995 index)

£4 ,4 6 7 , 0 0 0 £7,254,000 £6,883

,0 0 0

2. Othercommunity social andpersonal

se r v ices (Section O of the 1995 index)

£5 ,3 1 5 , 0 0 0 £4,528,000 £4,506

,0 0 0

16. Private households with (not and'')

 employed persons No records are kept.

17. Additional information

1. Tax payable by wage earners across all

in d u stries

£ 4 2 , 1 1 4 ,0 00 £44,987,000 £48,3

5 9 ,0 00

2. Tax payable by rentiers and the

re t ir ed

£ 1 8 , 5 20,000 £15,510,000 £15,0

3 5 ,0 00

3. TaxpayablebyInvestment holding

co m  panies (mainly local residents' co r p orate bodies set up to hold their in v e stments)

£3 ,6 5 6 , 0 0 0 £4,033,000 £4,504

,0 0 0

4. Company tax payable not classified

u n d er any heading

£ 9 0 9 ,0 0 0 £ 1,213,000 £1,443

,0 0 0

Covering letter

Dear Senator Syvret,

TAX LIABILITIES BY INDUSTRY

Further to the answer the President of the Finance and Economics Committee gave in the House at its last sitting, I am sending you the figures he said would be provided if they were available before the House next met.

Compiling these figures has presented a few difficulties -

1. The sectors listed in yourquestionseem to  b e taken from the Jersey Standard

 I ndustrial Classification issued by the

 C hief Adviser's Office two years ago (the

  1995 index''). The 1995 index encompasses   economic activities'' in the widest sense

o f the phrase and those you have reproduced

 t owards the end of the list are services

 w hich are provided exclusively (or almost

 e xclusively) by the States themselves. The

 p rovision of these services does not of

 i tself produce any direct tax revenue

 ( because, of course, the States doesn't pay

 t ax on its own income). But there are

 i ndirect tax benefits which do accrue

 b ecause we do tax States' employees on

 t heir wages. However, my computer system  h asn't been programmed to analyse

 e mployees' tax liabilities by reference to

 t he nature of their employment (I don't

 n eed this information and it's frightening

 t o contemplate the size of the task of

s etting up the coding - not to say

m aintaining it because people change their

 j obs so often: four or more times a year in

 s ome cases).

F or that reason none of my figures include t ax on wages (but at the end of the list

I 've given a separate figure for the total

t ax paid by employees).

 S enator S. Syvret 2 n d M ay, 1997

2. Someof the sectors youaskabout are so n arrow (e.g. quarryingwhere only two or t hree firms are involved) that to supply

t his information would be to breach their p rivacy.

W here this applies I have said information not provided'.

3. As a general point, the tax liabilities

 l isted reflect the tax payable by each

 p erson classified as being within a certain  s ector. So if, for example, a farmer also

 h ad income from other sources (say bank

 i nterest, dividends and income from letting  p roperty) his total tax liability on his

 t otal income from farming, interest,

 d ividends and rents will be included in the  f igures for the Agriculture industry.

I have highlighted this point under the h eading for Real Estate.

4. Othersmall points arose and I have dealt  w ith them underthe various headings.

If there's anything I haven't made clear then please give me a ring. I'd be happy to go through the figures with you.

Yours sincerely, Deputy Comptroller''

Agricultural industry - questions and answers (Tape No. 390)

Senator Richard Joseph Shenton asked Deputy Jeremy Laurence Dorey of St. Helier, President of the Agriculture and Fisheries Committee, the following questions -

1.  W ill the President inform the

H o u s e of the amount of financial ai d d is tributed to the various

s e c to r s of the industry, and would h e a c c ept that these large amounts

o f p u b lic money are provided to

th e in d ustry in order that the

co u n t r yside may be protected and w o u l d he agree that this is being

sp o i le d by the introduction of

la r g e m echanical equipment,

in c l u d ing tractors and

ju g g e r nauts?

 2 .  Will the President inform the House if h e i s concerned about the increase in

f a ct ory farming which is foreign to the c h a racter of the Island?

 3 .  Will the President give the House a

b r e akdown of the size of dairy units in J e rs ey and compare this with those on t h e Continent?

 4 .  Will the President inform the House how m  u ch assistance is allocated to

e n c ourage organic dairy farming and if

h e i s aware of the successful marketing

o f o rganic products in United Kingdom

s u p ermarkets and the premium that they a t tr act, and whether he considers that

o r g anic milk should be available in the

I s la nd and, if so, advise the House

w  h at action will be taken to end the

p r e sent restriction?''

The President of the Agriculture and Fisheries Committee replied as follows -

1.  T he vast majority of the

ag r i c u ltural budget is used to

en c o u r age good agricultural

p ra c t ic e by both growers and dairy f a rm  e rs alike. The aid takes the

fo r m o f grants, loans, subsidies

an d s e rvices and is available to

la r g e a nd small growers. In terms

o f d ir e ct financial aid, however,

as fa r a s possible, the approach

o f th i s Committee will be to

en c o u r age investment in viable

se c t o rs of the industry rather

th a n h and-outs designed to prop up in h e r e ntly unviable sectors.

T h e total of direct aid in the

A  g riculture and Fisheries Committee's

b u d get for 1997 is £3,388,800 and in

1 9 9 6 agricultural loans amounting to

£1 , 778,660 were made to 15 growers and f a rm ers.

W  h ile I would agree that one of the m  ai n purposes of financial aid is to

e n s ure that the countryside is

m  ai ntained as a green backcloth to the I s la nd, it is of paramount importance t h at those who farm make a profit that e n a bles them to play their part in

p r o tecting the countryside. In farming,

a s i n other industries, machines have

t e nd ed to get bigger and I am sure

t h er e are cases where banks and hedges h a v e been damaged, just as buildings

h a v e been damaged in town by oversized l o rr ies. In general this damage has

b e e n minimal. It should also be

r e m embered that the farming community c a rr ies the brunt of the responsibility

f o r caring for the appearance of the

c o u ntryside, through its responsibility

f o r the branchage and maintenance of

h u n dreds of miles of hedges.

F a r ming is not a quaint countryside

p u r suit. It is a business which is

d e p endent on both modern techniques and m  ac hinery. Even so, I can assure

S e n ator Shenton and the House that my

C o m mittee and the farming industry take v e r y seriously their duty of

g u a rdianship of the countryside.

T h e Jersey Farmers' Union, with the

h e lp of my Department, is in the

p r o cess of preparing a Code of Practice t o p lace before the Comité des

C o n nétables. When agreed, this Code

w  il l reinforce the proper management of l a rg e vehicles on country roads. I

a p p laud this initiative and believe

t h at in doing this the farming

c o m munity is acting in a responsible

w  ay .

 2 .  I would be concerned about any increase i n f actory farming, however, as far as

I a m aware there is no factory farming

o n the Island. There are of course

h o l dings that are farmed intensively;

p r o viding all reasonable standards of

g o o d husbandry and environmental care a r e observed then these units are part

o f t he farming scene to be observed

a n y where in the world.

 3 .  I believe the clearest method of

p r e senting the information requested by t h e Senator is in the form of a table -

A  n alysis of dairy herd sizes shown as a p e r centage

S i z e of Jersey Guernsey Isle of *France

h e r d M a n

1 - 9 25 2 0 4 l ess than 1 %  

1 0  - 19  10 7 5 4  2 0  - 29 5 1 1 1 0 1 7 3 0  - 49  17 2 7 4 1 4 9 5 0  - 69 5 1 6 1 6 2 1 7 0 and

o v e r  3 8 1 9  2 4 9  

* F i gures for France are for La

Manche only.

 4 .  The Committee does not give any

s p e cific financial support to

e n c ouraging any form of organic

f a rm ing, but existing farmers and even t h o se wishing to enter the industry are g i v en access to all the Department's

s e rv ices.

O  rg anic products do attract a premium

b u t it is an overstatement to talk of

s u c cessful marketing of organic

p r o ducts in United Kingdom

s u p ermarkets - the perceived demand is v e r y small indeed. Where there has been s o m e success has been in box

m  ar keting' of horticultural crops. Box

s c h emes allow the consumer to obtain a m  ix ed box of organic vegetables on a

w  ee kly basis in exchange for a fixed

c o n tribution. Such schemes work well on a s m all scale, highly localised basis,

b u t it would be unrealistic to expect

t o b e able to use box schemes to market l a rg e quantities of local produce.

T h e re is already one producer of

o r g anic milk on the Island whose

p r o duct is marketed by the Jersey Milk M a rketing Board but mixed with the milk f ro m other producers. If there is a

s tr o ng local demand for organic milk -

a n d there has been no indication of

t h is - then customers should identify

t h ei r need to the Board, who in turn

w  il l have to assess if the extra cost

o f p rocessing this milk separately

w  o uld give the producer an adequate

r e tu rn.

T h e Committee has no wish to discourage

o r g anic production; however, we believe t h at continued efforts to reduce

c h e mical inputs and deal efficiently

w  it h waste products are far more likely

t o h ave a large-scale impact on further

e n h ancing the quality of production and

t h e impact of farming on the

e n v ironment.

T h e Department recently held a one-day e n v ironmental conference with a number

o f v ery knowledgeable speakers.

U  n fortunately, although the conference w  as well supported by the industry, and g e n erally considered to have been a

g r e at success, it did not receive the

s u p port from States members which I

b e li eve it deserved. Those who did take t h e trouble to attend will be aware of

h o w much the industry in Jersey has

a l re ady achieved in environmental

t e rm s, and how strong is the will, on

t h e part of both the industry and the

C o m mittee, to build on our successes in t h e future.''

Decision Conferencing Programme - question and answer (Tape No. 390)

Senator Richard Joseph Shenton asked Senator Pierre François Horsfall, President of the Policy and Resources Committee, the following question -

  Will the President inform the House of  t he total cost to date of employing

 c onsultants for the Decision Conference  p rogramme for prioritising revenue and  c apital budgets and the Law Drafting

 p rogramme, and state the period of the  c onsultants' contract and if there is to be  a review of the present procedure?''

The President of the Policy and Resources Committee replied as follows -

  The cost of consultants for the decision

 c onferencing undertaken in 1995, 1996 and  1 997 (excluding the cost of training local

 a nalysts in the latter two years) is

£ 21,000 for 1995, £75,500 for 1996 and

e stimated at £83,000 for 1997 - a total of

£ 179,500 over a three year period when

 c ombined capital and revenue expenditure

w ill total well over £800 million.

T he present contract which covers revenue,

c apital, law drafting and I.T. is limited

t o the 1997 programme (which commenced in N ovember 1996 and which will be completed b y June of this year).

A s in previous years, my Committee will be undertaking a full review of the corporate

r esource allocation strategy in the light

o f the 1996/1997 experience, including a

r eview of decision conferencing procedures, w ith particular reference to revenue

e xpenditure. The way forward will be

i ncluded in the 1997 Strategic Policy and

A ction Plan, which is scheduled for debate i n September of this year.''

Hospital consultants - questions and answers (Tape No. 390)

Deputy Frederick John Hill of St. Martin, asked the Connétable of St. Saviour, President of the Health and Social Services Committee, the following questions -

1.  W ill the President inform the

H o u s e if he is concerned about the p u b li c 's disquiet relating to the

lo n g w aiting lists for initial

co n s u l tation and subsequent

m e d i ca l or surgical treatment from h o sp i ta l consultants, and advise

o f th e delay in the following

d ep a r t ments -

( a )  Orthopaedic ( b ) E.N.T

( c ) Ophthalmic ( d ) Dermatology ( e ) Paediatric

( f) Surgical.

 2 .  Will the President state how many

h o s pital consultants are on full-time

c o n tracts, how many hours they are

c o n tracted to work for the hospital's

p u blic' patients, and to what extent

t h es e contracts allow for private work?

 3 .  Will the President inform the House how m  an y consultants are on part-time

c o n tracts, and the minimum hours that

t h ey have to work for the Department of H  ea lth and Social Services, and explain t h e monitoring system to ensure that

t h e conditions of the contracts are

b e in g fulfilled?

 4 .  As the consultants achieve housing

s ta t us on the basis of their hospital

p u b lic work, will the President explain w  h y they are not all on full-time

c o n tracts to ensure that the public's

n e e ds are provided before the needs of p r iv ate patients?

 5 .  Would the President advise if the

H  ea lth and Social Services Committee h a s considered introducing a Hospital P a t ients Charter?''

The President of the Health and Social Services Committee replied as follows -

1.  I appreciate that patients wish to

re c e iv e medical or surgical

tr e a tm  ent at the earliest

o p p o rt unity and assure members of

th e H o use that every effort is

m a d e t o minimise delay. I would

p o in t o ut that all emergency cases ar e d ea lt with immediately and

u rg e n t cases are seen within a

v er y sh ort time.

T h e waiting times for non-urgent out- p a ti ent appointments for the

s p e cialities listed are as follows -

O  rt hopaedics 16 weeks (although

ch i l d re n w i ll be seen

w i th i n f iv e weeks)

E . N .T. e ight weeks

O  p hthalmology nine weeks (although chil d r e n will be seen within seven weeks)

D  er matology  11 weeks

P a e diatrics  seven weeks

G  en eral surgery s ix w e e ks

T h e out-patient waiting time can,

h o w ever, be greater if the patient

p r e fers to see a particular consultant.

T h e priority for out-patient

a p p ointments is determined according to t h e clinical need, which is indicated

b y the general practitioner when he

r e fe rs his patient to a hospital c o n sultant. If any patients feel their c o n dition has changed and that the w  ai ting time is unacceptable, they

s h o uld discuss the matter with their g e n eral practitioner who will decide w  h ether he should indicate a higher p r io rity.

T h e waiting times for non-urgent in-

p a ti ent treatment vary significantly

a c c ording to the clinical priority.

H o wever, the Health and Social Services C o m mittee has set a standard that no

p a ti ent should wait in excess of 12

m  o nths for non-urgent treatment, and

m  o st patients wait considerably less

t h an this time. The in-patient waiting

t im  es in the specialities listed are as

f o ll ows -

O  rt hopaedics: 66 per cent of patients a r e a dmitted within three months and 96 p e r cent are admitted within six

m  o nths.

E . N .T.: 6 7 per cent of patients

ar e ad m  i tt e d within three

m o n t h s a n d 90 per cent are ad m i tt e d w  ithin six

m o n t h s .

O  p hthalmology: 30 per cent of patients a r e admitted within three months and 52 p e r cent are admitted within six

m  o nths.

G  en eral surgery: 94 per cent of patient s a r e admitted within three months and 1 0 0 per cent are admitted within six

m  o nths.

I n d ermatology and paediatrics patients a r e treated without delay and there is

n o waiting list as such.

I n r egard to the waiting list for non-

u r g ent ophthalmology treatment, a small n u m ber of patients wait for slightly

m  o re than a year; however, measures are a l re ady being taken by my Committee to e n s ure that the waiting times are

r e d uced for this speciality.

W  h ilst I am aware that a minority of

p atients have complained about waiting t im  es, I and members of my Committee a r e not aware of any general public d i sq uiet as suggested by the

q u e stioner.

 2 .  Eight hospital consultants are employed

o n full-time contracts and are required

t o w ork for the public service

s u b stantially the whole of their

p r o fessional time. This involves a

c o m mitment of 11 sessions each week,

w it h each session lasting approximately 3 ½ hours - that is a total of 38½ hours

a w  eek.

I t s hould be noted that, in addition to

d a y -time work programmes, consultants c o v er out-of-hours emergencies and the

o n - call rota is part of the

p r a ctitioners' contractual obligation.

A c onsultant is required to be

i m m ediately available when he is on- c a ll ' and to attend the hospital in

p e r son if necessary. In smaller

d e p artments with few doctors, for

e x a mple paediatrics, ophthalmology or E . N .T., the greater out of hours

d e m ands are recognised by allowing a

r e d uction in fixed contractual

c o m mitments. These on-call allowances v a r y depending on the speciality

c o n cerned, the number of consultants

p r o viding cover for the service, and

t h e level of demand made upon them.

I n a ddition to their public work, full-

t im  e consultants are permitted to

u n d ertake a limited amount of private

w  o rk, up to a maximum income of ten per c e n t of their whole-time earnings.

C o n sultants may undertake this work

p r o vided their essential commitment to

t h e public service is not diminished.

 3 .  Twenty-seven consultants are currently e m p loyed on maximum part-time

c o n tracts. This involves a commitment

o f t en sessions of 3½ hours, making a

t o ta l of 35 hours a week. Maximum part- t im  e consultants are also expected to

d e v ote substantially the whole of their

t im  e to public duties. These

c o n sultants also provide significant

o u t -of-hours cover as indicated in the

p r e vious answer.

E a c h consultant has a negotiated job

p l an which provides a detailed

d e s cription of the duties and

r e sp onsibilities of his position. The

j o b plan identifies the nature and the

t im  ing of the consultant's fixed

c o m mitments, for example operating

t h ea tre sessions or out-patient

c l in ics, which account for between five

a n d seven sessions a week. The precise

a r ra ngement for each consultant depends

o n the out-of-hours commitment expected

o f h im. The arrangements are monitored a n d reviewed annually on the

C o m mittee's behalf by the Service

D  ir ectors. The remainder of the

c o n tracted hours comprise ward rounds, a d m inistration, teaching and medical

a u d it. There is also a detailed

b r e akdown of the average number of

h o u rs spent each week on Health and

S o c ial Services Committee business.

 4 .  As indicated in my previous answers, m  o st consultant contracts in Jersey are m  ax imum part time, which require that t h e consultant devotes substantially

t h e whole of his professional time to

p u b lic work. There is good evidence

t h at consultant medical staff

s ig n ificantly exceed their contractual

o b l igations to the public service. This

i s p articularly so in a small acute

g e n eral hospital, where the demands

p l ac ed on medical staff can be

d i sp roportionately high. I wish to put

o n record my Committee's appreciation

f o r the sterling work done by local

d o c tors and the commitment and

d e d ication they show towards the

s e rv ice.

T h e local terms and conditions of

e m p loyment for medical consultants are v e r y similar to those in the United

K  in gdom National Health Service and

t h is consistency is important to ensure

t h at candidates of the highest calibre

w  il l continue to be attracted to work

f o r the Health and Social Services

C o m mittee. In the United Kingdom,

c o n sultants have the option of working f u ll time or part time and the

C o m mittee believes that to change this p articular term and condition of

s e rv ice would not be in the Island's

i n te rests.

T h e Deputy infers that private patients a r e being treated to the detriment of

p u b lic patients. I wish to reassure

m em bers of this House that this is not t h e case. As I have already stated,

c o n sultant medical staff on maximum p a r t-time contracts devote

s u b stantially the whole of their

p r o fessional time to public work.

 5 .  The Health and Social Services

C o m mittee considered the introduction

o f a Patients' Charter soon after the

i d ea was launched in the United Kingdom a n d decided against it.

T h e key elements of the United Kingdom P a t ients' Charter comprise a process of

s ta n dard setting and performance

m  o nitoring. In addition, a range of

p u b lic information is made available to

h e lp people understand what standards

t h ey should expect. Patients are also

e n c ouraged to indicate if the treatment

t h ey have received does not meet the

e x p ected standards.

H  o wever, the United Kingdom Patients' C h a rter initiative has been the subject

o f m ajor criticism. Concern about

m  ee ting the Charter standards can

d e tr act from good patient care. For

e x a mple, efforts to meet waiting time

s ta n dards have led to patients with

m  in or conditions being treated before

t h o se with more serious conditions in

o r d er to ensure the hospital does not

f a ll short of the waiting time

s ta n dard. Another illustration relates

t o A ccident and Emergency Departments, w h ere a patient may be briefly assessed

b y a triage nurse within the required

C h a rter time, but may then be left

w  ai ting for hours on a trolly before

r e ce iving treatment.

T h e se are some of the reasons why the H  ea lth and Social Services Committee h a s decided to take a different

a p p roach. My Committee undertook an e x te nsive public consultation exercise w  h en it was developing the current

s tr a tegy for Health and Social

S e r vices, approved by this House in O  ct ober 1996. Many members of the p u b lic contributed their views on our s e rv ices and the standards of health

a n d social care they expect to receive.

T h e Committee is now implementing its s tr a tegy and developing performance

i n d icators to monitor the standards of

i ts s ervice. The department has also

p u b lished a wide range of public

i n fo rmation booklets and introduced a H  ea lth and Social Services telephone

i n fo rmation line to inform people of